{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/dn3zs2m03j/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Cockburn, Alexander, Lands, Trees and Justice"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/004/original/ISULogo.png?1601681107","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Iowa State University. Special Collections and University Archives"]}},{"label":{"en":["Identifier"]},"value":{"en":["RS008-006-053 (call number)","AV203879 (UID)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["Lands, Trees and Justice is a November 7, 1989 event in the Iowa State University Lecture Series featuring Alexander Cockburn. Alexander Cockburn discusses challenges to protecting the Amazon rainforest.","This item was captioned by Rev.com in conformance with WCAG 2.1 AA accessibility guidelines. 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Affairs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=8.29,9.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'd like to take this opportunity to thank all of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=9.78,13.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"committee members.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=13.4,14.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Tony Smith for his contributions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=14.89,17.658"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you, Tony.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=17.658,19.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Our faculty chair, Gary Tartakov and of course","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=19.05,22.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Pat Miller, who made this series of lectures","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=22.47,25.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so many other lectures that happen on campus possible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=25.46,29.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have a couple of announcements to make.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=29.12,31.04"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"First, International Week will be starting on Monday","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=31.04,34.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and running through Friday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=34.15,35.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We have some brochures or flyers of these on the table","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=35.7,39.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the corner.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=39.26,40.093"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You might want to take a look at that on your way out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=40.093,42.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Also, there are some flyers, an invitation to a town meeting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=42.43,46.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the ecological crisis and that's gonna be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=46.27,49.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on Sunday at the Ames Public Library at four.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=49.47,54.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So some people are doing some things on a local level.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=54.4,57.363"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Also as of to what's happening with our series here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=58.27,62.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Tomorrow unfortunately our scheduled speaker at noon","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=62.47,66.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mr. James O'Connor, that lecture has been canceled.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=66.69,70.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Apparently he had back surgery and won't be able to join","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=70.66,73.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"us tomorrow evening though we'll continue as scheduled","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=73.49,76.986"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with George WoodWell.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=76.986,79.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He will lecture and his topic is the Warming Earth,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=79.74,82.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Scientific Puzzle and Political Dilemma.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=82.88,86.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He is the founder and director of the Woods Hole Research","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=86.61,89.957"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Center and he also founded and directed the Ecosystem Center","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=89.957,92.696"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the Marine Biological Laboratory at Woods Hole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=92.696,96.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in Massachusetts.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=96.71,97.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you might want to put that one on your calendar also.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=97.64,101.043"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So far this week, Barry Commoner, Anne Ehrlick","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=102.07,105.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and Paul Watson have given us much to think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=105.0,107.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about as we consider our roles in the global environment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=107.55,111.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It is encouraging to see that so many people have 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writer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=116.58,120.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the planet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=120.06,120.983"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It is an honor to have Alexander Cockburn with us 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writing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=126.52,129.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for political prisoners in Northern Ireland,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=129.93,132.762"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the striking coal miners in Virginia,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=132.762,135.545"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the fate of the rainforest in the Amazon.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=135.545,139.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Alexander Cockburn is known to many of us 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on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=144.575,149.369"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"His new book, The Fate of the Forest: Developers, Destroyers","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=149.369,153.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and Defenders of the Amazon has just been 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mystique,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=210.02,213.783"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"particularly in considering an area like the Amazon.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=214.87,219.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Where people as we'll see are calling for the Amazon to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=219.71,224.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"preserved in its natural state","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=224.18,226.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and coming up with various 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Because there'd been a particularly rapacious","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=1292.62,1296.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"delegation from the IMF had come down and said, you know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=1296.44,1298.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710/transcript/25993/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've got public 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I'd like to take this opportunity to thank all of the committee members. Tony Smith for his contributions. Thank you, Tony. Our faculty chair, Gary Tartakov and of course Pat Miller, who made this series of lectures and so many other lectures that happen on campus possible. I have a couple of announcements to make. First, International Week will be starting on Monday and running through Friday. We have some brochures or flyers of these on the table in the corner. You might want to take a look at that on your way out. Also, there are some flyers, an invitation to a town meeting about the ecological crisis and that's gonna be on Sunday at the Ames Public Library at four. So some people are doing some things on a local level. Also as of to what's happening with our series here. Tomorrow unfortunately our scheduled speaker at noon Mr. James O'Connor, that lecture has been canceled. Apparently he had back surgery and won't be able to join us tomorrow evening though we'll continue as scheduled with George WoodWell. He will lecture and his topic is the Warming Earth, the Scientific Puzzle and Political Dilemma. He is the founder and director of the Woods Hole Research Center and he also founded and directed the Ecosystem Center at the Marine Biological Laboratory at Woods Hole in Massachusetts. So you might want to put that one on your calendar also. So far this week, Barry Commoner, Anne Ehrlick and Paul Watson have given us much to think about as we consider our roles in the global environment. It is encouraging to see that so many people have sat. That there are so many people here this evening as we welcome another distinguished thinker and writer for the planet. It is an honor to have Alexander Cockburn with us here this evening. He brings a history of socially conscious writing for political prisoners in Northern Ireland, to the striking coal miners in Virginia, to the fate of the rainforest in the Amazon. Alexander Cockburn is known to many of us through his writings for the Nation, the Wall Street Journal, the Village Voice, Esquire and the list goes on and on. His new book, The Fate of the Forest: Developers, Destroyers and Defenders of the Amazon has just been released. There are also copies of that here. You might want to take a look at them. And on that note, I will let Mr. Cockburn continue. Please join me in welcoming Mr. Alexander Cockburn.\r\n\r\n- Well, the title of my talk was Lands, Trees and Justice Politics and the Environment. And I really wanted to start by concentrating a little on the idea of what is natural. People constantly talk about nature and natural forces, natural processes and the word attracts a great mystique, particularly in considering an area like the Amazon. Where people as we'll see are calling for the Amazon to be preserved in its natural state and coming up with various solutions, supposedly towards that end. And whenever you hear the word natural you really wanna watch out because it can be very misleading. I had just come from Northern California. I live in a place called the Adobe Motel which has the distinction of being about 15 miles from the epicenter of the recent earthquake. So natural forces have been somewhat on my mind. And you know, you've got to say to yourself what could be more natural than an earthquake. Tectonic forces finally giving a release of energy and upsurge and the rest of it. That's true But also what could be more political than an earthquake? If you start thinking of the earthquake as a political event, it can be very illuminating. Some of you may remember from the early seventies photograph of Managua in Nicaragua right after the earthquake which destroyed a substantial portion of downtown Managua. And the only structure standing that you could see in most of the photographs was the Catholic Church. Why was the Catholic Church standing? Because it was very well built. And the Good Fathers got a good brand of cement. You look at the... And of course the earthquake in Managua was political in its consequence. It really precipitated the final phase of Somoza because of the way the earthquake was handled. With Somoza and his people stealing all the aid money. When you think about the earthquake and Armenia which disclosed basically that what with your bureaucratic finagling and corruption a lot of the high rises were built with more than may be most could stand. So they all fell down. The town right below me in Northern California is Watsonville which in the six months of the summer produces about 80% of the fresh vegetables consumed in the United States with the help of lot of chemicals that shouldn't be said. Well, how did the natural earthquake deal with Watsonville? When you drive around and Watsonville you saw that the earthquake had been very selective in class terms. It had spared the substantial houses which were built pretty well. And what it had done is it popped a lot of the smaller working-class houses off their foundations. How many of you're ever gonna live in an earthquake prone area? Maybe some of you already do. It's not too hard to anchor your house to the foundation years. It doesn't cost much. But the natural force and the consequence on the house was clearly visible in the destruction of about 400 working class homes in Watsonville. What else happened in the earthquake, the natural event? You had landslides on a route 17 which connects Watsonville and Santa Cruz with San Jose. Why were there landslides because there had been extensive clearing for the roadway and of course the trees had been taken out, a lot of them. So you have the weakened top soil and down came the landslide. Even in San Francisco itself a lot of the condemned houses are in the Marina district which is built on landfill which tends to liquefy in an earthquake. So once again, the natural consequence is expressed in socio-political terms. Actually the disaster so called was greeted with tremendous excitement and was a great boom to many people in Northern California. Like the insurance industry. Insurance industry had been lamenting that their rates were very low that they could charge. And obviously the earthquake allows you to send the rates up. And most of all, it was a boom for the urban equivalent of people who deforest. Developers. I might read you a quote from a leading developer in the city of Santa Cruz. Anyone here for Santa Cruz? No Santa Cruz is always regarded as the quintessential hippie sixties town. And in the wake of the earthquake, a guy called Louis Rittenhouse, who's the... one of the leading developers walked down the destroyed main street and said we're gonna bring Santa Cruz into the 20th century. He went on as the city council was saying, the other night some things that were tolerated in Santa Cruz will be tolerated no longer. Like panhandling and sleeping on park benches. Over is over. The earthquake shook up the political system in Santa Cruz. The reason I'm going on some length about the earthquake, is to stress this point, how nature, ideas of nature are in many ways political and expressed in political and class terms. One of functions of the press, mainstream press naturally not to stress natural forces takes people's eyes off the idea of political forces. If you say it's all nature, who are you gonna blame. Unless you wanna blame God or someone like that. But the more you look at it, the more you can see that there are really very few natural disasters. Indeed. They are either made or compounded by man. They are political. Actually again, to take another of so-called or disaster, which has environmental aspect the kind of drug war obsession with cocaine. You'll notice very rarely President Bush ever reflects on why there should be a cocaine plague as he called it. Why he never asked, why should cocaine suddenly become the economic mainstay of the Andean countries worth trade worth about $60 billion a year? And why cocaine and crack consumption should have swelled in the Reagan Bush years? Because obviously to do so is to address rather difficult political issues. Like the fact that the US economy no longer offers any future for young black males of any sort in America's in the cities. Or that the world export commodity economy presents to an Andean peasant very few options in deed. What does an Andean peasant gonna do? Have a cow? Grow some maize or some other crap like that and make maybe a few dollars or a few hundred dollars on a plot or grow coca make $5,000, $10,000. These economic realities are usually ignored. And bearing that in mind, bearing the fact that the political should be central whenever we're examining any crisis or trying to analyze what's going on. We might look at the Amazon and the proposed solutions to deforestation in the Amazon. Of course the Amazon is regarded as the very quintessence of nature. The last Eden or as a Brazilian writer called it the last unwritten chapter of Genesis. A lot of the ways that the Amazon is discussed have an enormous gap at their center. People. Time and again you can read discussions of the Amazon on the possible loss of species, on the environmental effects, the greenhouse effect on the effects of deforestation on weather patterns. And you would not know that the Amazon is home. Amazonia is home to maybe 2, 3 million people who are not going to disappear. The analogy for many people I suspect here, some environmental groups is how to save the Amazon and they tend to think of a park or like Yosemite beginning of the national park system founded by John Muir. And it's an analogy that is really worth thinking about because what happened when they set up Yosemite was they drove out the mid work Indians. It was a natural park, which was unnatural from the word go. Yet, you can today read many analysis of the Amazon which talk about literally buying up huge swaths of the place. Surrounding it with so to speak barbed wire, not exactly. Shutting people out and saying we saved the Amazon. Indeed under the Nossa natureza program proposed by President Sarney last year an enormous area national park is being set up on the Southwestern border from which about 12,000 people are gonna be expelled. So right away, when you're looking at the various equations between land, preserving trees you see that there might be a contradiction in the sense that they're not ensuring any form of justice. And if you talk to people who live in the Amazon whether they be rubber tappers or Indians the first words out of their mouths they will talk about respect for the environment, they will talk about preserving the environment, preserving natural resources, but the word that tends to pop out of their mouth very soon is justice. So the first illusion to dispel is the idea of Amazonia or the Amazon or the rainforest is somehow non-human nature. Nature that should be sequestered from humans. One thing it's actually almost impossible to do. I mean, anyone looks even on that a national park in the North America, the invasions that tend to be usually by corporations with their various concessions. And then in the Amazon how are you effectively really going to please an enormous area and stop people trying to settle down or gold miners trying to go there or whatever. Well as first of the anchid of North American group some North American groups two ways to save so to speak in quotes the Amazon. And there is a tendency which I think has to be watched to think that the agents of destruction and the agents of salvation in the Amazon are to be found in the first world. That somehow imperial or transnational corporations are basically the people to blame in the Amazon and somehow international pressure is gonna save the Amazon. And both of these are a little misleading more than a little misleading, rather profoundly misleading. For example, why are trees falling in the Amazon? Right now there are various estimates of how much of the forest is left. Some more pessimistic assessments say that looking at the Amazon rainforest as against a hundred years ago 20% have gone. The Brazilian government says 5% have gone. A fairly prudent estimate is about 10%. But the rate of deforestation remember is increasing exponentially. So if you out and flying over the Amazon, I mean you do see a lot of trees like for a whole day. A pilot got lost the other day on VARIG Airlines and he flew for three hours and still didn't know where he was. He was going in the wrong direction. But why did those trees suddenly begin to go really in the last 15 to 20 years? Many of you hear a whole number of theories. You have the hamburger connection. Every time you bite a hamburger you're basically chewing down a tree. In the sense that the tree has been clear to let the cattle there for pasture. This really isn't true of the Amazon. It's true to a certain extent in Central America. Actually, the Amazon is a net beef importing area. So that really doesn't go that one. Is it... some people say it's debt. The fact that Brazil is the largest of all the indebted nations in the third world to the first world banks, owing about $119 billion. That the exorbitant demands and they are by the way exorbitant, in terms of interest of the first world banks backed by the first world institutions, such as the IMF forced Brazil to concentrate on its export sector which leads them to deplete natural resources. And there is a truth in that. It's actually not true at the moment of Amazonia. Most of the hard currency items that Brazil is exporting tend to be soybean or citrus products from the South. This is not to say that social injustice in Brazil overall is not tremendously compounded by Brazil's indebtedness to the first world which it certainly is. I was down earlier this year in Rio de Janeiro and the public hospitals were closed because they had no supplies. Some of them were closed. They had no supplies. Why? Because there'd been a particularly rapacious delegation from the IMF had come down and said, you know you've got public hospitals. This indicates yet that you are not yet fully understood the discipline of the free market. But indebtedness Brazil's indebtedness does not really account for why the forest has been chopped down. Timber exploitation. There is a considerable amount of it but that alone cannot account for it. And the real answer actually is found Brazilian strategies of development evolved by the Brazilian generals who took over the country in 1964. Now here you could say that the US if you're trying to trace a line of responsibility does deserve some blame. Because the United States was extremely infavorable to the coup that put General Castelo Branco and his associates in power in 1964. The leading actor in this was a General Vernon Walters whose service career some of you may have followed down the years, particularly painful. Gentlemen, the US did not actually provide direct materials for the coup, but it had carriers Navy carriers off the coast, and it had shipments of arms ready at McGuire Air Force Base in New Jersey. There were very keen that Goulart be overthrown. And the Brazilian generals involved in various stages of strategy of development for the Amazon. Seeing this over 50% of the national territory as unexploited. The Amazon since the word go, since what might be called first contact in 1500 has always been the receptacle of fantasies is about what you could get out of it. Like say with Mark Twain. How to become a coca trafficker. Mark Twain the US Navy sent down Lieutenant Herndon in 1840s to assess the Amazon its potential and Herndon returned and wrote up his trip, which was published. He said, one of the things about the Amazon we saw was this marvelous stuff called coca which gave you great powers of endurance. And Twain, Mark Twain was living in Iowa at the time in Keokuk Iowa. Well, I'll read you excerpt of what he said, excuse me. The national writer proporting to President Bush Mark Twain wrote an essay called The Turning Point of My Life. I was fired with a longing to ascend the Amazon. Also with a longing to open up a trade in Coca with all the world. During months I dreamed that dream and tried to contrive ways to get to Para, which is the mouth of the Amazon. In New Orleans, I inquired and found there was no ship leaving for Para . Also that they'd never been one leaving for Para. I reflected a policeman came and asked me what I was doing. And I told him. He made me move on and said that he caught me reflecting in the public street again, he would run me in. On my way down the Mississippi I'd made the acquaintance of a pilot. I begged him to teach me the river and he consented. I became a pilot. See so if he'd had the right shipping schedules you'd have had Huck Finn set on the Amazon. Might have been pretty good. Everyone had their dreams of how to exploit the Amazon. Henry Ford had his dream. He thought he would cultivate rubber plantations in the thirties. Set up a rubber plantation on the Tapajos River called Fordlandia. The workers didn't... They sent down a lot of people from Detroit and tried to persuade the workers to go into square dancing and other helpful Midwestern pursuits didn't go down very well. And the plantation was a catastrophe because of leaf blight. Later Danielle Ludwig tried to, another North American magnate tried to build another enormous plantation in Jari. Sent down teams of experts with their bulldozers to prepare the plantation, cut down the rainforest to plant fast growing pine trees. And then as they prepared the ground they scraped all the valuable top soil away with their fine bulldozers and another disaster ensued. The Amazon has always been receptacle of fantasies that it could be the bread basket of the world. Soil course is rather poor in the Amazon unless you beef it up. If you're gonna try and grow crops and cut down the trees, you have to beef it up with incredible amounts of fertilizer. Anyway, the Brazilian generals said we must make use of this national asset and resolved a series of programs. Incentive programs. Initially for large business groups and capitalists from the South. Offering them fantastic tax incentives essentially negative rates of interest on loans and enormous land grants of up to a million, 2 million acres to industrial concerns to settle in Amazonia. They started cutting the roads and they started settler schemes as well. What essentially happened was that the Amazon land in the Amazon became an instrument of tremendous speculation. And over the last 30 years what has happened in this process of trying to acquire the means to speculative instrument is an enormous enclosure movement taking essentially a public asset the rain forest, and privatizing it. Exactly as it happened in the United States in the 19th century and before. Now the way you secure an asset in the Amazon where titles is stupendously complicated is you you forge a title or you burn one that's inconvenient to you. And then to demonstrate that it's yours, you cut down the trees. That's the way that you get a further tax incentive or you used to do from the Brazilian authorities. Also when it turned out that a lot of this land was resting on substantial mineral resources the way you secure subsurface rights was by clearing the trees. Many of the people who bought this land had not the slightest intention of trying to farm it. They were merely investing in a land market where you got values going up by 50, 70, a 100, 200%. Also of course, one of the realities of Brazil is inflation. You got tremendous inflation every year and an important to hedge against inflation is land. If you can't keep money in the bank where are you gonna keep it? You can keep it in invested in cows or you can keep it invested in land. You can keep it in something that's gonna keep pace with the rate of inflation. So as the US first thought, the speculative fever that was launched by the Brazilian generals initial determination to develop the Amazon in the mid sixties by the middle seventies had really begun to disclose itself in tremendous deforestation. Now, as I'm sure many of you know deforestation and conversion to pasture in the Amazon which is the leading cause of deforestation is conversion to pasture for cattle is an extremely unproductive use of land. You of course, initially get a a nutrient flush from burning off the tree cover but this is soon leached off and fairly rapidly the land becomes extremely degraded. And can only really be sustained for agricultural production by the inputs, expensive inputs of fertilizer. Cattle ranching is of course also an extremely unproductive use of land. In terms of also employment it's very non-labor intensive. You get the initial high employment on land clearance maybe setting up your ranch after that It's very poor. So what you have got is destruction permanent destruction of rainforests and conversion to the least productive and most degrading use of land imaginable. This is the central fact of deforestation. What you've also got of course is many other consequences resulting from the overall political injustice and social dislocations in Brazil. Start with gold mining. There were maybe 300,000 guden perros gold miners in Amazonia. Many of them are small farmers, small settlers who either have been driven off their land by large ranching interests or they've been forced up from the South by mechanization of agriculture in the South. And they invade Indian lands like the Yanomami Indian lands in the North. And they set up these little place of mines. Now, what you've got there is one of the now in the making or now in the actually occurring is an enormous environmental disaster. For every ton of gold you can get out of the Amazon you're putting a ton of mercury into the atmosphere, the earth or the water in the process of refining the gold. This is as you know, mercury, one of the most... Mercury poisoning, one of those lethal forms of industrial poisoning made most famous in Minamata in Japan. But what's going on in the Amazon makes Minamata look incidental in terms of the mercury leaching into the water, into the soil, into the air, and of course into the people both miners and Indians in the various areas. So the reality of the Amazon is very large corporate entities basically sustained by government handouts. None of the large ranches are really productive on their own terms. Huge influx of settlers from the Northeast and from the South driven out by external political pressure. Economic pressure. Confronting the forest dwellers who are of course the Indians. I feel there are now about 200,000 in Amazonia and the rubber tappers. Who since rubber tapping which of course was the economic backbone of Amazonia really between about 1840 until about 1910 when British plantations and Dutch plantations in Asia, rubber plantations took over the rubber trade yielded tremendous wealth for a few people in Belem and Manaus. So what is the situation today? As I said the way the Amazonia is often perceived here is as something that to preserve it you put a fence around it and didn't try and keep people out. The Brazilian Government's line is orderly development. Denying most of the consequences that people say are happening with increasing lack of conviction. And particularly in the last three, four or five years you've had the growth of a very strong or increasingly strong indigenous movements and resistance. As a number of groups really began to speak more and more firstly for themselves. Firstly, the Indians. There had been another sort of visitation of the first world tended to be anthropologists. It's anthropologists that always think, I apologize to anthropologists in the audience I assume there must be some. They always seem to go basically for, you know third world people. So I guess this, you know, if you went to Lexington, Massachusetts and ask people the question that anthropologist ask third world people they wouldn't last very long. If I went to ask people in Ames Iowa they wouldn't last very long. Anthropologists tended to have their tribes whom they would study, you know, write that doctorate about, speak for and that would be that. The last 10 years, Indians have spoken much more for themselves and learnt very often with brilliant effect how to present their case in the first world. Another group similarly becoming more expert in expressing their views in the first world and operating politically within Brazil were the rubber tappers. Of course the... in a way the turning point for them came nearly a year ago on December the 22nd when Chico Mendes, the leader one of the leaders of the rubber tappers was murdered by gunmen for the UDR which is the Ranch's sort of league who've murdered literally hundreds of rural organizers across Amazonia shot him on the back porch of his house in Xapuri in Acre in far Western Amazonia. and the way Mendez's death and Mendez's life was reported here was in itself a rather interesting example of how the Amazon and how the politics of the Amazon are perceived. That in a way Mendez is made out to be a kind of St. Francis of Amazonia. Actually Chico Mendez was an extremely political person. He was rather an extraordinary story. There was a famous column in the twenties in Brazil called the Prestes Column. This was a bit like marchy Tom's Long March. The then captain Prestes led this column of guerrillas I guess you'd say through black country Brazil for three years, marched about 14,000 miles. In the late twenties Prestes went into exile in the Soviet Union. He came back in 1935 and was arrested soon thereafter. One of the people arrested with him was a man called Tavora who escaped from prison and went to Bolivia as a labor organizer. He came back across the border and set up in a rubber tappers shack in the middle of the forest. And Chico Mendez, his father said this guy Tavora will teach you to read. So that's how Chico Mendez learned his politics. Chico Mendez was extremely radical and was the co-founder of the Worker's Party which is a far left, strong left party in Acre. None of this really was spelled out when Mendez was assassinated. And one of the reasons again, leads us back to how there's struggle in the Amazon. Political struggle is translated for North American audience. I remember vividly sitting in Rio Branco in Acre not far from where Chico Mendez was assassinated. After a meeting of forest peoples and listening to a North American environmentalist say that they had a certain problem in portraying Mendez's politics that really well to a North American audience 'cause he would fight members as extremely left wing. And also saying that some of the political positions of the rubber tappers were rather difficult for them. Difficult in the sense that this environmental group is giving money. Because the rhetoric of the rubber tappers was outright socialism. They were talking about common ownership of assets. And he said, well, if we support that kind of thing it might endanger our 501c3 status. For those of you who haven't dealt with these things 501c3 is the tax exempt coding under treasury rules, IRS rules which I thought that remark spelled out with an extraordinary colorful way what the limitations of a North American some kinds of North American environmental support for third world group are. Because what is the reality as a rubber tapper Indian Alliance sees it? How do they say the Amazon can be saved? They say, we want to save the rainforest because it's our livelihood and our shelter. What does that mean? It means we want to go on controlling the forest in which we are now living. Which means that we dispute the ability of let's say the state of Acre to sell.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112710#t=0.0,2804.592"}]}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 2 of 2 - 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[Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e A part in Ireland where I was, where I grew up,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=5.211,7.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is called York, on the South Coast.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=7.65,10.713"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now Ireland is the Irish Republic is essentially","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=12.47,14.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a third world country","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=14.8,15.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"except people are white and they speak English","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=17.18,18.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so people forget that it's a third world country","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=18.71,23.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a third world economy and one of the things that happened","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=23.79,27.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the 70's as the environmental movement","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=27.48,32.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"here began to secure political gains,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=33.73,37.283"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was that a lot of the pharmaceutical companies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=39.13,41.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"went off shore","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=41.85,42.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with some of their basic manufacturing 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queue","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=284.27,289.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"still said, \"We do not want the plant here","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=289.94,291.727"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"which may provide us an income","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=291.727,293.277"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"but we'll end up poisoning our kids.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=295.467,297.467"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The company said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=301.67,303.487"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Automatically we don't regard this as conclusive,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=303.487,306.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Irish government said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=306.6,307.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"We don't regard this as conclusive,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=307.49,309.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Politicians said they'd wait and see","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=309.9,311.38"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and think about it a bit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=311.38,312.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The time to build the plant approached but two months ago,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=315.32,320.32"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"local groups said they we're gonna picket the site,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=324.31,327.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"farmers said they'd go on hunger strike,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=327.28,329.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the parent company, DAR Chemicals met in Cincinnati","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=331.19,334.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then they backed 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do,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=342.29,344.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not properly and connected with the objections","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=344.56,346.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the local people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=346.44,347.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To me, the extraordinary thing about that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=349.8,352.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the hard thing that they were was that, let's 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area","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=375.83,377.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if they could make the connections.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=379.071,380.821"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which means that the, one of the fundamental political tasks","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=385.07,390.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in this country as in many others,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=395.12,397.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is the forging of alliances","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=397.66,402.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between labor and environmentalist is a possible one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=402.69,407.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Obviously time and again one has seen labor unions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=412.88,415.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"reject environmental concerns","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=416.75,419.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the grounds that they might endanger jobs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=419.12,421.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That the lesson of Ireland, was that what's the point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=426.66,431.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of having a job if your kid's gonna be sick","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=431.99,434.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the rest of his life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=435.49,436.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The lesson of the Amazon is if you wanna save a tree,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=440.17,444.193"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've got to have a political system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=445.95,447.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that can sustain the economy which will save that tree.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=449.05,453.323"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In both these problems, you are having the redefinition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=455.62,459.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you like of our politics,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=459.74,461.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which I think by economic fluid of words","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=462.33,465.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sexism around the law and it's the word that has to be used","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=465.44,469.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and in the end I think, the only thing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=469.03,473.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that will produce justice and tree salvation in the Amazon","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=473.11,476.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or environmental safety anywhere else","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=476.15,479.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is an alternative to capitalism,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=481.0,482.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which of course is socialism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=482.39,484.533"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'll just end with a quote from Paiyakan,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=485.6,489.113"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who's the, one of the leaders of the Kayapo","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=490.32,492.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he said, \"The forest is one big thing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=493.432,495.607"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"it has people, animals and plants.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=495.607,498.103"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"There is no point in saving the animals","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=499.217,500.567"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"if the forest is burned down.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=500.567,502.193"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"There is no point in saving the forest if the 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Heck,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=777.61,780.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"plus I wrote this book with at Easter time,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=780.67,784.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a really tremendous guy called Rodriguez, he 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year,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=789.49,791.843"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as of his time, he's alive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=792.87,795.493"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You've had more people,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=797.17,799.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've had about 1,000 people assassinated,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=799.33,802.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this is peasant organizers, land organizers, et cetera.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=802.0,806.16"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In Brazil and more people, I think assassinated","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=806.16,809.16"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the so-called post total military dictatorship period","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=809.16,812.322"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of Saone then he did under the military.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=812.322,814.322"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the reality of repression and murders","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=818.44,822.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is tremendously real.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=822.22,823.453"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yet right now, Lula is I think, rising in the polls,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=824.83,829.83"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that appeared when you, they tried to pretend","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=831.96,833.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they weren't ready for radical change,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=833.59,836.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"tried to wrap it up a bit and they dropped like a stone.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=836.27,839.173"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When they began to take the gloves off","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=840.61,842.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and they're arising again, so we'll just have to see","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=842.8,845.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what happens but obviously you're right,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=845.68,847.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, it's a very formidable talk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=847.45,849.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e What do you think is the significance of what we're seeing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=851.53,854.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in East Germany, the popular movements","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=854.2,856.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that try to protect social justice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=856.24,859.669"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and environmental protection?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=859.669,862.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e The significance of what's going on in East Germany?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=862.26,865.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, I'd like to say it's socialism","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=865.31,868.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"springing in itself (chuckles).","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=868.15,870.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, I don't know, East Germany, Poland, Hungary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=870.52,874.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as you look at those, I look at them","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=874.47,876.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with very mixed emotions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=876.81,877.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, you can propose in that grant","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=877.94,881.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"freedom for what, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=882.56,883.583"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"freedom to become a sort of reserved labor pool","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=883.583,888.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the central, the German economy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=889.216,891.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"freedom to become a third world country in debt to the IMF.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=891.86,895.083"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What real substantial freedom","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=896.46,898.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is will sort of viably be able to inaugurate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=898.08,901.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean these countries who are retreating from","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=901.69,906.58"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or trying to remove","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=906.58,909.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from let's say the comic con the wolf of the pack,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=909.1,912.327"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or turn towards the market","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=912.327,914.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will obviously find that, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=915.24,917.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the discipline of the market is pretty rough,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=917.07,919.293"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"very rough, indeed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=922.16,923.333"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How long or in the parallel,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=925.13,929.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can make hundreds of parallels","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=929.4,931.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just looking at the newspapers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=931.54,933.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The way the minus strikes are reported in the Soviet union","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=933.67,936.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the way the minus strikes the reported here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=936.06,938.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"assuming you've been able to read","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=938.53,939.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the reporting of minus strike here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=939.64,941.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Pittstown strike.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=941.93,942.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, recently they had a takeover","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=942.87,945.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of an industrial facility, the first of that size,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=945.01,947.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"since 1937 and not reported at all about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=947.81,952.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's all these countries, well, Hungary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=954.08,957.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will soon start using capitalist methods","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=960.23,964.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of disciplining the economy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=964.31,965.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which of course is unemployment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=965.39,966.99"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"privatization of public wealth","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=972.02,973.883"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as happened in China, environmentally disastrous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=975.47,980.173"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, whether this will continue is mood,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=982.94,985.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Isaac Darcia in his book, \"The Unfinished Revolution,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=985.79,989.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I heartily recommend to people said, \"Surely,\" you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=989.01,993.427"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"If these bureaucratic systems","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=993.427,996.557"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"which have come ossified over the years,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=996.557,1001.513"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"and they are now being swept aside,\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1002.562,1004.412"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"nonetheless, the people who've slept from the side","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1009.14,1012.446"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have had the experience however horribly distorted","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1012.446,1017.446"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in their being and what's exactly odd.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1021.4,1025.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't tell if it's that through a capitalist economy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1025.17,1028.19"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of some of the, what you might call them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1028.19,1032.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"more beneficial aspects in the system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1037.49,1039.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of price has been held down in the Soviet Union","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1039.29,1041.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for a generation for housing or health or education","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1041.52,1045.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or whatever it might be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1045.82,1047.053"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How far would they be prepared to tolerate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1047.91,1050.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the discipline of the full market system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1052.05,1053.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and this is the fundamental question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1053.8,1055.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"obviously Eastern Europe and the Soviet Union face.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1055.82,1058.583"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, with Gorbachev, you can face undeployed Glasnost","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1060.8,1065.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which I do and ask a lot of questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1065.34,1068.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the Paris's strike.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1068.55,1070.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What kind of economic reform is it really?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1070.12,1073.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is it sort of, so to speak the ratification","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1073.03,1076.003"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the of a socialist economy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1076.003,1076.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether you know the emergence","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1076.94,1077.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of a new technocratic and elite","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1077.92,1081.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which you might call Markets Darwinism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1081.07,1083.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Will it be genuinely democratic?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1084.33,1086.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well yeah, these questions haven't been answered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1086.78,1088.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but they have to be asked.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1088.48,1089.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Fundamental questions seems to me is, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1090.93,1093.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what is the right, can a market be under socialism?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1093.3,1096.053"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If you're going to talk about a market","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1097.33,1098.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the loosening of you know, bureaucratic rigidity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1099.89,1103.313"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"democratization, democracy, control from below.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1105.25,1108.313"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how can these things keep worked out?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1109.51,1110.937"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But you do get, you don't get what happened in China","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1110.937,1115.457"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on that day, you know what, quite simply,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1118.34,1122.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they took a lot of public assets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1122.26,1123.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and handed them to the emerging over class,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1123.67,1128.19"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which in this case was a lot of the party bureaucracy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1128.19,1131.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"privatization, incredible squandering of social assets,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1131.54,1135.023"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seizure of public assets.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1137.15,1142.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Abandoning of environmental programs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1144.46,1147.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as anti erosion programs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1147.47,1149.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has everyone raised to have their own little plot,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1149.02,1151.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is in many ways it was an absolute catastrophe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1151.02,1153.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"These are absolutely fundamental questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1153.81,1155.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which needless to say, haven't got an answer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1155.47,1158.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e This brings up a question I am curious about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1159.64,1162.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that is, in general what's been the record","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1162.2,1165.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of socialist environment in regard to environmental issues,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1165.24,1169.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that is something we've not learned too much about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1169.01,1172.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e The record of socialist governments","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1172.0,1173.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in regard to environmental issues.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1173.52,1176.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's really too bad, but that Jim O'Connor","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1176.01,1178.317"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who wasn't backing it up, he really does have a bad back","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1178.317,1182.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"'cause he lives right near me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1182.03,1182.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he was to be here tomorrow","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1182.93,1185.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to discuss capitalism, socialism in mention.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1185.89,1189.443"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The record in many ways has been horrifying","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1190.83,1192.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of, except rapid industrialization,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1197.299,1199.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you just look at the Soviet Union,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1199.82,1202.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've got the consequences of the nuclear program","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1202.45,1206.603"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"revealed in Chernobyl,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1211.73,1213.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've got the incredible, the drying up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1213.81,1216.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the inland seas, you've got in Eastern 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Hungary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1227.35,1229.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you've got tremendous environmental pollution.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1230.02,1233.283"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which should also be said that, you 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more","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1242.41,1243.83"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"except that unspoiled territory","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1243.83,1248.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than anywhere else in the world,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1248.53,1249.363"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"simply 'cause it's so vast.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1249.363,1251.09"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's a lot of the Soviet Union,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1254.05,1255.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like there's a lot of the Amazon.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1255.28,1257.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, in other environmental,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1258.28,1262.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you could go right through the list","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1262.5,1263.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"depending on what you call the environmental health,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1263.78,1265.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can, you have to start looking","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1265.75,1267.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at things like industrial 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society","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1275.71,1278.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is much lower, you know and you're shoving so much poison","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1278.39,1281.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"down your sink for 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anti-erosion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1308.25,1312.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"many of which have not been reversed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1313.12,1314.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The fundamental point,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1317.47,1320.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which O'Connor I think likes to make","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1320.79,1322.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is, if a society has got off,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1322.94,1326.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a social society has got off","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1326.51,1327.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"its rapid industrialization kick,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1327.88,1330.383"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"even the end will a socialist economy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1333.4,1336.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"be more benign for the environment than the capitalist one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1338.02,1340.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the answer should be theoretically yes,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1342.53,1345.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because the profit incentive is not there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1345.65,1347.823"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Under capitalism, you have to grow, you have to make a buck.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1349.37,1352.695"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And how do you make a buck?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1352.695,1354.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, all these chemical companies always say, you know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1354.69,1356.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the water we're gonna put into the, this and this and that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1356.86,1359.186"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the water we are gonna put into the stream","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1359.186,1361.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is cleaner than your tap water, to which you will say,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1361.27,1363.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well, go and take a bath in it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1363.39,1364.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"let's watch you do it and then drink it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1364.57,1367.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then of course they never do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1367.35,1368.869"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(laughing loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1368.869,1369.702"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Actually, theoretically you could speculate the water run,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1369.702,1371.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then cost them a lot of money,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1371.69,1373.933"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"tremendous amount of money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1373.933,1376.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But they don't want to spend the money,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1376.51,1377.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they don't want to waste the bucks,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1377.54,1379.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so in the end, a profit oriented system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1379.49,1382.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will lead to degradation of the environment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1382.79,1385.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So there again, you have, you know, it's an open question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1385.5,1389.803"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e All these political connections","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1392.685,1395.435"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"inevitably are we contacted the United States.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1397.144,1399.914"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What about the United States","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1399.914,1403.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it's matters to report on socialism claims in Brazil","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1403.03,1406.893"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it rewards you even when you are dealing in private","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1408.043,1411.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in such a way that you aren't volunteering with the land","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1411.34,1415.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and possibly nationalize like (mumbles).","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1415.13,1417.397"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What do you think is the possibility of it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1419.82,1422.464"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That you know, that they are not gonna be involved","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1422.464,1423.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a negative way?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1423.68,1425.024"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I think it would be extremely likely","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1425.024,1426.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the United States would be involved in a negative way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1426.82,1428.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, the US does not like progressive regimes (laughs)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1428.89,1433.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the third world, let's face it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1435.85,1438.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, they didn't, Nicaragua is the obvious example.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1438.01,1443.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, Oxfam produced a very good pamphlet one time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1443.91,1448.42"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about Nicaragua called, The Threat of The Good Example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1448.42,1451.163"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"talking about what the Nicaraguans had done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1452.91,1455.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of, you know, in terms of usage","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1455.23,1458.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and of their resources in terms of, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1458.23,1461.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in terms of literacy, in terms of all the things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1461.78,1464.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you never read about it from the US press.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1464.85,1467.083"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, of course the US has sponsored as a protective measure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1469.92,1474.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some forms of land reform, usually as a political attempt","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1474.5,1479.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to outflank and annul the threat from the left,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1479.12,1483.16"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, you can think of Korea, South Korea","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1483.16,1485.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can think of Taiwan,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1485.25,1486.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can think of the attentive that observe land reforming.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1486.4,1491.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"El Salvador, even, which was done by some of the people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1492.93,1496.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who tried it in South Vietnam again with disastrous results,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1496.59,1501.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but fundamentally the US will be opposed to because,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1501.87,1504.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, they're opposed to public ownership of resources.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1504.11,1507.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They're opposed to fundamentally and most internally","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1507.86,1511.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and absolutely, they are opposed to anything","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1511.43,1513.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that might resemble Cuba (chuckles),","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1513.33,1515.698"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, just the leading devil country in the world today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1515.698,1518.463"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(inquiring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1520.223,1523.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I ca--, can you stand?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1525.13,1527.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I can't hear you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1527.15,1527.998"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you stand up?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1527.998,1530.146"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(inquiring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1530.146,1533.063"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do I see the, a correlation between the indigenous,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1566.48,1570.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the survival of indigenous groups","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1570.72,1572.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the learning of how to manage their ecosystems","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1572.4,1576.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a responsible sustaining way?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1576.74,1579.037"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(concurring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1579.037,1579.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, absolutely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1579.87,1580.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean the, one of the best examples in the Amazonia","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1580.8,1585.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the Kayapo, indeed this substantial portion of this book","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1585.02,1588.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is devoted to just that very second.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1588.87,1590.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(laughing loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1590.76,1591.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Actually it is, I'm not even lying.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1591.76,1593.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The Kayapo have a tremendous, Darrell Posey","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1594.37,1598.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has done a large amount of work on this, as some of you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1598.1,1600.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who read Darrell Posey's work, anthropologist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1600.2,1602.523"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on sustainable agriculture and incredibly elaborate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1604.64,1609.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"complex systems for, of land use and land management","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1609.8,1614.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a self-sustaining fashion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1614.43,1615.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the fact that the Kayapo have, who being brilliant,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1616.84,1621.84"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"politically speaking in terms of bringing the situation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1625.27,1630.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to North America and to Europe and the rest of the world,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1632.06,1635.593"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it's clear and then there are sort of programs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1637.93,1642.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"now in Amazonia that, you know, these traditions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1644.57,1647.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of use of land by the Kayapo, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1648.975,1652.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are now taught in universities and there was no,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1652.62,1656.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is an effort now, a recognition","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1656.89,1660.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that what you're looking at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1660.33,1661.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is an incredible storehouse of knowledge.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1661.21,1664.533"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(inquiring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1665.548,1668.465"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why here, well, you know, there's a tremendous","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1684.24,1685.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"tradition of techno hubris (laughs), you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1685.9,1689.093"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if a guy wears a white coat or a woman wears a white coat","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1689.093,1691.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the lab, it's all right, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1691.87,1693.146"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but if you've got a feather in your head, you know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1693.146,1694.288"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it must be, he must be an idiot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1694.288,1696.488"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, basically it's a racism problem rather.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1696.488,1698.838"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Can we get one more question?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1700.317,1703.414"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(inquiring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1703.414,1706.331"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e The, you mean the, it's relationship?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1708.083,1710.968"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(inquiring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1710.968,1713.885"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I didn't quite, 180 what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1715.837,1717.608"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(inquiring loudly)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1717.608,1720.525"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How often, right, all right,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1727.947,1729.012"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sorry, I couldn't hear what you said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1729.012,1729.845"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think you said ethnic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1729.845,1731.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, you mean, the cane spirit for the cost and stuff?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1731.66,1735.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah well, it's just a very substantial program,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1735.05,1736.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you can ask me how much I can't tell you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1736.91,1738.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"'cause I don't know, but it is the, it might be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1738.4,1742.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"very under sugar cane production","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1745.073,1747.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the gas of our livelihood, is very high indeed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1747.39,1751.023"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Someone was just telling me actually that they visited","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1753.15,1757.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a cane plantation recently","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1757.62,1761.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the workers there agitating for a clinic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1762.93,1767.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"'cause they were getting up to three snake bites a day","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1767.06,1769.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and losing, of which one of the three very often was lethal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1771.02,1775.863"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it was another example of social justice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1777.3,1779.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"going hand in hand with environmental issues.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1779.9,1782.974"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That was kind of daunting, anyone, one more question, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1782.974,1787.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Is the farming of sugarcane beneficial or destructive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1787.22,1792.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to clear jungle land?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1793.77,1796.263"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I think the lesson here and I think in any area","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1797.45,1799.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where you, if you take increasingly huge areas","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1799.75,1803.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of rain forest and rent them to mono-crop production","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1803.74,1806.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the end, you are, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1806.45,1809.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"tending to irreversibly alter the environment,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1809.03,1811.84"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that would be damaging to that extent.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1811.84,1814.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Of course you could argue, I mean, what are the trade-offs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1814.5,1816.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you're using you know, sugar cane for, as fuel, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1816.35,1819.777"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're not using gas and you've got to trade-off that way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1819.777,1823.234"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't know how you're to bounce that one, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1823.234,1825.884"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you very much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1826.945,1827.955"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(audience clapping)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=1827.955,1830.955"}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25995/annotation/498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/025/995/original/AV203879_Lands_Trees_and_Justice_b.vtt?1620667489","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/025/995/original/AV203879_Lands_Trees_and_Justice_b.vtt?1620667489"}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25996","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["AV203879_Lands_Trees_and_Justice_b.txt [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711/transcript/25996/annotation/499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"﻿- A part in Ireland where I was, where I grew up, which is called York, on the South Coast. Now Ireland is the Irish Republic is essentially a third world country except people are white and they speak English so people forget that it's a third world country a third world economy and one of the things that happened in the 70's as the environmental movement here began to secure political gains, was that a lot of the pharmaceutical companies went off shore with some of their basic manufacturing processes. They went into Mexico, they went to Puerto Rico and many of them for the European market went to Ireland. Encouraged to do so by the Industrial Development Authority in Ireland, which was desperate to get jobs. Since Ireland has chronic unemployment, people talk about the immigration from East Germany now. The immigration right from Ireland, you know, ever since I was born, has been somewhere between 30,000 and 70,000 a year at least. So what happened is that a large number of chemical companies, pharmaceutical companies set up shop in Cork city, Cork Harbor. Why did they do that? 'Cause they were offered substantial tax incentives by the Irish government and above all they confronted no form of environmental regulation at all. The Irish had no way of knowing, they didn't ask A and if they had asked they wouldn't have been able to find out B. Since a lot of chemical companies lie, they would have had no way of evaluating the lies. With the result that by the late 70s, that is 80s, Ireland's become one of the top 20 exporters of pharmaceuticals in the world. And the fish in Cork Harbor were beginning to mutate, and marine life was beginning to mutate, kids around Cork Harbor were beginning to develop chronic ailments, then last year, DAR Chemicals decided they wanted to open up a plant in Ireland to produce Terfenadine, which kind of anti-histamine. They did not want to go to Cork City because they foresaw this is, at last it's gonna become a controversial topic, subject to the lawsuits possibly, so they headed down to where I grew up, went to where I grew up near West Coast, down in Queen, actually. It was called the Greenfield site, some of the best dairy producing land in Ireland and so decided they wanted to set up shop here. The Irish Industrial Development Authority had a terrific idea, no problem at all, we'll help you do it. What then happened was extremely interesting. The area one that, this is an area of chronic unemployment and emigration, maybe 40, 50% unemployment at times. Every time it has most of its people go to London or United States. But, the local farmers objected because a lot of them are doing pretty well out of dairy stuff and they were frightened that che-- the plant would wreck their land, which it would. But the local environmental group did something which I thought was courageous and politically very sensible, they commissioned one of the best polling groups in Ireland to do a poll, to say do you want this pharmaceutical plant here or not? Of course, the great weapon of this company has always been well, you know, you middle-class environmentalists may not want this plant here but working people sure do, 'cause it means jobs, it means income for the shopkeepers and so forth. Well, the poll came in and it showed that two thirds of the people in the area did not want the plant. Which means basically the people whose wage earners were in the dole queue still said, \"We do not want the plant here \"which may provide us an income \"but we'll end up poisoning our kids.\" The company said, \"Automatically we don't regard this as conclusive,\" the Irish government said, \"We don't regard this as conclusive,\" Politicians said they'd wait and see and think about it a bit. The time to build the plant approached but two months ago, local groups said they we're gonna picket the site, farmers said they'd go on hunger strike, the parent company, DAR Chemicals met in Cincinnati and then they backed down and said they wouldn't build the plant. Needless to say for reasons to do, not properly and connected with the objections of the local people. To me, the extraordinary thing about that and the hard thing that they were was that, let's say a generation of attention to the environment. The lessons really had penetrated, soaked through to working people in a very sorely afflicted area if they could make the connections. Which means that the, one of the fundamental political tasks in this country as in many others, which is the forging of alliances between labor and environmentalist is a possible one. Obviously time and again one has seen labor unions reject environmental concerns on the grounds that they might endanger jobs. That the lesson of Ireland, was that what's the point of having a job if your kid's gonna be sick for the rest of his life. The lesson of the Amazon is if you wanna save a tree, you've got to have a political system that can sustain the economy which will save that tree. In both these problems, you are having the redefinition if you like of our politics, which I think by economic fluid of words sexism around the law and it's the word that has to be used and in the end I think, the only thing that will produce justice and tree salvation in the Amazon or environmental safety anywhere else is an alternative to capitalism, which of course is socialism. I'll just end with a quote from Paiyakan, who's the, one of the leaders of the Kayapo and he said, \"The forest is one big thing, \"it has people, animals and plants. \"There is no point in saving the animals \"if the forest is burned down. \"There is no point in saving the forest if the people \"and animals who live in it are killed or driven away. \"The groups trying to save the animals cannot win \"if the people trying to save the forest lose. \"The people trying to save the Indians cannot win \"if either of the other loses. \"The Indians cannot win without the support of these groups \"but the groups cannot win without the help of the Indians \"who know the forest of the animals \"and can tell what is happening to them. \"No one of us is strong enough to win it alone, \"together we be strong enough to win,\" thank you.\r\n\r\n- The Corporal said that he would welcome some of your questions.\r\n\r\n- Okay, well. I, say that last sentence again. Well, the question really is where in Brazil can one see evidence or portents of political upheaval or political change? Well, if you follow events in the Brazil, I mean, last year in the cities, people were astounded by the tremendous success of the Worker's Party. They ran a woman, Luiza Erudina in Sao Paulo and to the absolute stupefaction of everyone, including, I suspect the Worker's Party, she won and became the mayor of Sao Paolo which is a bit like, you know, it was equivalent and sharp as if Jesse Jackson had practically become president of United States. I mean, it was an absolute, what did that really mean? It meant that there was a tremendous pool of support for someone advocating really vigorous socialist policies. Now this is of course, this was repeated in some other Brazilian cities. Obviously, the habitat for land reform in Brazil is tremendous. I mean, you've got a country though but that's the staggering disproportionate, probably the most staggering disproportions in income and wealth in the world. There's a tremendous reservoir of social, you know, fury if you like. Now, whether this will can produce, can lead to change, of course, it's a different matter. For one thing there's always coercion. I mean, you had, after all, you did have a generations worth of military dictatorship installed in 64 partly to head off land reform. You have, you know, you have in the Amazon, you know, the difficulties of just organizing, it could be in terms of union organizing along the politics of the animism union politics. Organizing in the Amazon is extremely difficult. We've got organizers, you know, moving up river and you know, along difficult tracks, the sheer physical difficulties are immense and of course they face constant reality of assassination. We've got the guy I interviewed with Susanna Heck, plus I wrote this book with at Easter time, a really tremendous guy called Rodriguez, he said, \"You know, you have two,\" actually he thought he had a 2% chance of surviving the year, as of his time, he's alive. You've had more people, you've had about 1,000 people assassinated, this is peasant organizers, land organizers, et cetera. In Brazil and more people, I think assassinated in the so-called post total military dictatorship period of Saone then he did under the military. So the reality of repression and murders is tremendously real. Yet right now, Lula is I think, rising in the polls, that appeared when you, they tried to pretend that they weren't ready for radical change, tried to wrap it up a bit and they dropped like a stone. When they began to take the gloves off and they're arising again, so we'll just have to see what happens but obviously you're right, I mean, it's a very formidable talk.\r\n\r\n- What do you think is the significance of what we're seeing in East Germany, the popular movements that try to protect social justice and environmental protection?\r\n\r\n- The significance of what's going on in East Germany? Well, I'd like to say it's socialism springing in itself . I mean, I don't know, East Germany, Poland, Hungary as you look at those, I look at them with very mixed emotions. I mean, you can propose in that grant freedom for what, you know, freedom to become a sort of reserved labor pool for the central, the German economy, freedom to become a third world country in debt to the IMF. What real substantial freedom is will sort of viably be able to inaugurate. I mean these countries who are retreating from or trying to remove from let's say the comic con the wolf of the pack, or turn towards the market will obviously find that, you know, the discipline of the market is pretty rough, very rough, indeed. How long or in the parallel, you can make hundreds of parallels just looking at the newspapers. The way the minus strikes are reported in the Soviet union the way the minus strikes the reported here, assuming you've been able to read about the reporting of minus strike here, the Pittstown strike. Well, recently they had a takeover of an industrial facility, the first of that size, since 1937 and not reported at all about. It's all these countries, well, Hungary will soon start using capitalist methods of disciplining the economy, which of course is unemployment, privatization of public wealth such as happened in China, environmentally disastrous. Now, whether this will continue is mood, Isaac Darcia in his book, \"The Unfinished Revolution,\" I heartily recommend to people said, \"Surely,\" you know, \"If these bureaucratic systems \"which have come ossified over the years, \"and they are now being swept aside,\" nonetheless, the people who've slept from the side have had the experience however horribly distorted in their being and what's exactly odd.\" I don't tell if it's that through a capitalist economy in terms of some of the, what you might call them, more beneficial aspects in the system in terms of price has been held down in the Soviet Union for a generation for housing or health or education or whatever it might be. How far would they be prepared to tolerate the discipline of the full market system and this is the fundamental question, obviously Eastern Europe and the Soviet Union face. I mean, with Gorbachev, you can face undeployed Glasnost which I do and ask a lot of questions about the Paris's strike. What kind of economic reform is it really? Is it sort of, so to speak the ratification of the of a socialist economy, whether you know the emergence of a new technocratic and elite which you might call Markets Darwinism. Will it be genuinely democratic? Well yeah, these questions haven't been answered but they have to be asked. Fundamental questions seems to me is, you know, what is the right, can a market be under socialism? If you're going to talk about a market and the loosening of you know, bureaucratic rigidity, democratization, democracy, control from below. how can these things keep worked out? But you do get, you don't get what happened in China on that day, you know what, quite simply, they took a lot of public assets and handed them to the emerging over class, which in this case was a lot of the party bureaucracy, privatization, incredible squandering of social assets, seizure of public assets. Abandoning of environmental programs such as anti erosion programs has everyone raised to have their own little plot, is in many ways it was an absolute catastrophe. These are absolutely fundamental questions which needless to say, haven't got an answer.\r\n\r\n- This brings up a question I am curious about and that is, in general what's been the record of socialist environment in regard to environmental issues, I think that is something we've not learned too much about.\r\n\r\n- The record of socialist governments in regard to environmental issues. It's really too bad, but that Jim O'Connor who wasn't backing it up, he really does have a bad back 'cause he lives right near me and he was to be here tomorrow to discuss capitalism, socialism in mention. The record in many ways has been horrifying in terms of, except rapid industrialization, if you just look at the Soviet Union, you've got the consequences of the nuclear program revealed in Chernobyl, you've got the incredible, the drying up of the inland seas, you've got in Eastern Europe, you've got water poisoning, in Poland and Hungary you've got tremendous environmental pollution. Which should also be said that, you know, actually the Soviet Union probably contains more, maybe along with the average and more except that unspoiled territory than anywhere else in the world, simply 'cause it's so vast. There's a lot of the Soviet Union, like there's a lot of the Amazon. Now, in other environmental, you could go right through the list depending on what you call the environmental health, you can, you have to start looking at things like industrial safety you have to look at production of chemicals. In a way, the Soviet Union is free of a certain number of industrial chemicals cuts quite clearly the level of consumerism in the society is much lower, you know and you're shoving so much poison down your sink for example. You know, there are a held number of trade-offs you have to go through. In China environmental program on the, at an earlier period had a polling and beneficial aspects to it. You had, you do have tremendous conservation schemes tremendous like forest anti-erosion many of which have not been reversed. The fundamental point, which O'Connor I think likes to make is, if a society has got off, a social society has got off its rapid industrialization kick, even the end will a socialist economy be more benign for the environment than the capitalist one. And the answer should be theoretically yes, because the profit incentive is not there. Under capitalism, you have to grow, you have to make a buck. And how do you make a buck? I mean, all these chemical companies always say, you know the water we're gonna put into the, this and this and that and the water we are gonna put into the stream is cleaner than your tap water, to which you will say, well, go and take a bath in it, let's watch you do it and then drink it, then of course they never do. Actually, theoretically you could speculate the water run, and then cost them a lot of money, tremendous amount of money. But they don't want to spend the money, they don't want to waste the bucks, so in the end, a profit oriented system will lead to degradation of the environment. So there again, you have, you know, it's an open question.\r\n\r\n- All these political connections inevitably are we contacted the United States. What about the United States and it's matters to report on socialism claims in Brazil and it rewards you even when you are dealing in private in such a way that you aren't volunteering with the land and possibly nationalize like . What do you think is the possibility of it? That you know, that they are not gonna be involved in a negative way?\r\n\r\n- Well, I think it would be extremely likely that the United States would be involved in a negative way, I mean, the US does not like progressive regimes in the third world, let's face it. I mean, they didn't, Nicaragua is the obvious example. I mean, Oxfam produced a very good pamphlet one time about Nicaragua called, The Threat of The Good Example, talking about what the Nicaraguans had done in terms of, you know, in terms of usage and of their resources in terms of, you know, in terms of literacy, in terms of all the things that you never read about it from the US press. Now, of course the US has sponsored as a protective measure some forms of land reform, usually as a political attempt to outflank and annul the threat from the left, I mean, you can think of Korea, South Korea you can think of Taiwan, you can think of the attentive that observe land reforming. El Salvador, even, which was done by some of the people who tried it in South Vietnam again with disastrous results, but fundamentally the US will be opposed to because, you know, they're opposed to public ownership of resources. They're opposed to fundamentally and most internally and absolutely, they are opposed to anything that might resemble Cuba , you know, just the leading devil country in the world today. I ca--, can you stand? I can't hear you. Can you stand up? Do I see the, a correlation between the indigenous, the survival of indigenous groups and the learning of how to manage their ecosystems in a responsible sustaining way? Yeah, absolutely. I mean the, one of the best examples in the Amazonia is the Kayapo, indeed this substantial portion of this book is devoted to just that very second. Actually it is, I'm not even lying. The Kayapo have a tremendous, Darrell Posey has done a large amount of work on this, as some of you who read Darrell Posey's work, anthropologist, on sustainable agriculture and incredibly elaborate complex systems for, of land use and land management in a self-sustaining fashion. And the fact that the Kayapo have, who being brilliant, politically speaking in terms of bringing the situation to North America and to Europe and the rest of the world, but it's clear and then there are sort of programs now in Amazonia that, you know, these traditions of use of land by the Kayapo, you know, are now taught in universities and there was no, there is an effort now, a recognition that what you're looking at is an incredible storehouse of knowledge. Why here, well, you know, there's a tremendous tradition of techno hubris , you know, if a guy wears a white coat or a woman wears a white coat in the lab, it's all right, you know, but if you've got a feather in your head, you know it must be, he must be an idiot. I mean, basically it's a racism problem rather.\r\n\r\n- Can we get one more question?\r\n\r\n- The, you mean the, it's relationship? I didn't quite, 180 what? How often, right, all right, sorry, I couldn't hear what you said, I think you said ethnic. Yeah, you mean, the cane spirit for the cost and stuff? Yeah well, it's just a very substantial program, if you can ask me how much I can't tell you 'cause I don't know, but it is the, it might be very under sugar cane production is the gas of our livelihood, is very high indeed. Someone was just telling me actually that they visited a cane plantation recently and the workers there agitating for a clinic 'cause they were getting up to three snake bites a day and losing, of which one of the three very often was lethal. So it was another example of social justice going hand in hand with environmental issues. That was kind of daunting, anyone, one more question, yeah.\r\n\r\n- Is the farming of sugarcane beneficial or destructive to clear jungle land?\r\n\r\n- Well, I think the lesson here and I think in any area where you, if you take increasingly huge areas of rain forest and rent them to mono-crop production in the end, you are, you know, tending to irreversibly alter the environment, so that would be damaging to that extent. Of course you could argue, I mean, what are the trade-offs if you're using you know, sugar cane for, as fuel, you know, you're not using gas and you've got to trade-off that way, I don't know how you're to bounce that one, you know. Thank you very much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/2486/collection_resources/40888/file/112711#t=0.0,1843.536"}]}]}]}