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do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=400.72,404.84"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that has to do with the environment around us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=404.84,407.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It could be animals, it could be 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you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=428.55,430.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I know from being with them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=430.69,433.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"their preference is to have 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from,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=439.54,441.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm guessing because they're interested in learning","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=441.24,443.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just as you are too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=443.39,445.083"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We'll stop about 9:30.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=446.06,448.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's my pleasure to introduce to you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=448.48,451.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doctor Baird Callicott.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=451.07,452.453"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(audience 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much,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=461.2,465.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how much honored I am to be invited here","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=465.07,468.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to Iowa State University.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=468.37,469.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is my second formal visit to Iowa State.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=469.79,474.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was here in 1987 at an event that was lasted several days","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=474.843,479.843"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it was in this building in a number of the rooms","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=483.13,486.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Centennial celebrating the hundredth anniversary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=486.07,490.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of Aldo Leopold's birth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=490.54,492.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Aldo Leopold is I'm sure all of you know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=492.46,495.42"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"being here for an environmental ethics event","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=495.42,500.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was the author of \"A Sand County Almanac\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=500.2,505.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is sometimes referred to as","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=505.73,507.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Bible of the contemporary conservation movement","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=507.47,511.32"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and Leopold is a native son of Iowa.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=511.32,516.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He was born and raised in Burlington","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=516.15,519.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so that's why this event was held here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=519.15,523.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's organized by Tom 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case.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=586.66,589.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To take an example that every sophomore is familiar with,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=589.96,593.873"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"suppose someone asks a philosopher is Socrates","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=594.79,599.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and since the original Socrates is of course,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=599.01,603.42"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"demonstrably moral, I'll make this a personal Socrates","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=603.42,608.42"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when we he's not yet dead","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=608.81,610.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so we don't really know for sure in his case,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=610.28,613.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"his Socrates demopolis who let us hypothesize","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=613.25,617.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a contemporary Greek American","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=617.93,619.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who owns a restaurant in Ames-mortal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=619.81,623.663"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The philosopher asks first are all men and mortal","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=625.15,626.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and addressing that question with inductive logic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=626.73,631.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so far they all our, therefore all the rest must be as 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man.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=642.39,646.623"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Our philosopher returns to the original question","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=648.04,650.58"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"confidently concludes that yes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=650.58,652.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Socrates is mortal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=652.87,655.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"One example I'm sure you're all familiar with,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=655.33,658.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so does the Iowa prairie have intrinsic value?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=658.0,662.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Proceeding according to the pattern","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=662.25,663.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"first it was just illustrated,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=663.68,665.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"let's ask more generally,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=665.27,667.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"do preference have intrinsic value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=667.41,670.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether they are in Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=670.57,675.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Kansas, Nebraska or wherever","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=675.9,678.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but even that question is not general 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communities.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=692.07,697.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Moving up another rung on the generalization ladder,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=697.06,700.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we might ask, do biotic communities have intrinsic 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prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=724.76,728.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have intrinsic value or even do biotic communities","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=728.33,732.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have intrinsic 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them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=750.48,754.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is to define the terms in which they are formulated.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=754.46,758.773"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In the textbook example, men does not refer to 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way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=766.58,771.58"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to human beings irrespective of gender.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=771.65,774.743"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And leaving up with another question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=775.59,776.617"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the question of life after death,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=776.617,779.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"mortal refers to somatic not psychic 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species","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=1363.37,1365.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as big bluestem, Indian grass,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=1365.92,1368.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"compass plant, round-headed bush clover,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=1368.3,1371.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"lupine and butterfly weed to mention but few,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=1371.08,1374.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it's individual components have 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clover,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=1382.209,1386.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this sprig of lupine and this particular butterfly weed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=1386.95,1391.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that doesn't sound right, does 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system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2163.93,2166.933"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As I understand it, value is not an independently","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2167.84,2171.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"existing object of 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valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2178.93,2181.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Something that we can and should value for its own sake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2181.6,2186.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why? Because it is a type and a very paradigmatic type","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2186.9,2191.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of that, of a biotic community","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2191.29,2194.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and from an ecological point of view,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2194.21,2196.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we human beings are members of hierarchically organized","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2196.69,2201.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"biotic communities no less than we are members","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2201.49,2205.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of hierarchically organized human community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2205.01,2208.003"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Most of us intrinsically value the ladder.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2208.92,2212.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We value intrinsically our families,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2212.81,2216.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"our home towns and cities, our countries,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2216.33,2220.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if we're patriotic and global human civilization.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2220.29,2225.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And to the extent that we are biologically literate,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2225.15,2228.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the extent that we have absorbed the wider implications","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2228.54,2232.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the theory of evolution and the principles of ecology,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2232.64,2236.32"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we ought intrinsically value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2236.32,2239.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the former forest prairie's lakes and streams,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2239.49,2244.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"marine communities and the biosphere in which we live,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2244.25,2248.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"move and have our being.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2248.71,2251.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Further we intrinsically value the component species","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2251.17,2253.99"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of intrinsically valuable biotic communities.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2253.99,2257.09"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"According to Leopold, they should continue to exist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2257.09,2260.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a matter of biotic right regardless of the presence","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2260.07,2263.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or absence of economic advantage to us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2263.66,2268.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, that's my understanding of how the Iowa prairie","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2268.47,2273.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is intrinsically valuable and thank you very much","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2273.1,2277.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for your attention this Saturday evening.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2277.61,2280.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(audience clap)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2280.02,2282.687"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I do want to thank you for inviting me here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2290.505,2293.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I'd like to thank Professor Callicott","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2293.28,2295.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for doing a really admirable job of explaining","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2295.73,2299.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then illustrating how philosophers approach questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2299.63,2303.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as does the Iowa prairie have intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2303.02,2307.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just to sort instead of summarize where we are so far,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2307.12,2310.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the conclusion he reaches might be summarized this way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2310.11,2313.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he wants to say yes the Iowa prairie","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2313.11,2315.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is a biological whole, which we can and should","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2316.18,2320.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"value for its own sake not just for the usefulness","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2320.98,2324.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it might have to something or someone else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2324.5,2328.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, what I wanna try to convince you of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2328.3,2330.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that there are two major claims, two major problems","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2330.47,2334.19"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the claim that the Iowa prairie has intrinsic value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2334.19,2337.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that these problems are serious enough","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2337.67,2339.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we really can't yet accept","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2339.92,2341.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Professor Callicott conclusion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2341.9,2344.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In short, I think that the prairie","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2344.03,2345.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"does not have intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2345.98,2348.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now before going any further, let me sort at least","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2348.74,2352.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"fictitiously or imaginatively brandish","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2352.54,2354.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"my nature conservancy card","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2354.48,2356.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and tell you that I'm a great fun of prairies.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2356.52,2359.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I support them, I'm not saying","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2359.15,2361.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they're not important or valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2361.08,2363.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in any sense whatsoever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2363.02,2365.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My concern is really just with the philosophical","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2365.0,2367.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"underpinnings of that sort of claim.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2367.48,2369.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The claim that the prairie constitutes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2369.71,2371.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a biological whole and that its value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2371.62,2374.193"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's of a very special kind, namely intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2374.193,2377.653"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm going to focus specifically on the question","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2379.25,2381.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of primaries rather than ecosystems in general.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2381.52,2384.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So some of my arguments will apply only to prairie's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2384.46,2387.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I think that it's important to look","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2387.65,2389.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the philosophical underpinnings not just the goals.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2389.36,2392.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Light-minded people can all agree on goals","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2392.96,2395.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but that's not good enough.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2395.69,2396.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We need to figure out what the best possible 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yet","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2402.72,2405.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have seen the light.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2405.97,2407.073"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So let's start with the basic concept of intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2408.13,2412.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"First of all, I'm going to agree fully","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2412.25,2414.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with Professor Callicott,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2414.75,2416.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some of Professor Callicott general views on value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2416.52,2419.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Namely that we have to start asking questions","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2419.72,2422.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about value by looking back to the valuer,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2422.43,2425.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we're not gonna find it out there in the world","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2425.7,2427.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"independently of those who value it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2427.8,2430.803"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We can't just look for some elusive property.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2431.65,2434.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And moreover, I think is very specific strategy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2434.54,2437.16"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for identifying when we've hit intrinsic value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2437.16,2440.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as opposed to other kinds is a very good one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2440.21,2443.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He wants to tell us to look for what's left over","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2443.71,2447.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"once we subtract all the instrumental values","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2447.26,2450.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and see if there's something else of value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2450.77,2452.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's still left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2452.65,2453.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think we have to go at least one step further.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2453.93,2457.143"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now to claim that something has value of whatever sort","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2458.49,2461.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether we're talking about intrinsic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2461.53,2463.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or instrumental in this context, is not just a claim","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2463.12,2467.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that some valuer somewhere in the world","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2467.63,2470.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for whatever reason, attaches importance to that thing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2470.76,2474.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"indeed that may not even be a necessary condition.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2474.76,2477.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Professor Callicott and I and I hope everyone","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2477.91,2480.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who addresses this as an ethical question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2480.61,2483.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"speaks of not just any object that happens to be an object","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2483.43,2488.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of moral sentiment but the proper object of moral sentiment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2488.07,2492.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he insist that not only are prairie's things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2492.56,2495.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that some of his value but it's something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2495.52,2497.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we should value now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2497.57,2500.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, but if we wanna make claims like 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examples,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2508.21,2511.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Peter Singer gives reasons to show","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2511.3,2513.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"why he thinks we should recognize all sentient beings","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2513.44,2517.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as intrinsically valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2517.78,2519.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And professor Callicott talked a bit 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intrinsic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2529.44,2532.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If I wanna just claim that this is a good lecturing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2532.79,2534.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I should be able to give some 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criteria.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2705.96,2709.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So for example, if we justify protecting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2709.94,2714.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ecosystem like a prairie because it provides the habitat","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2714.54,2718.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which species which we wish to preserve can survive,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2718.57,2722.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's an instrumental value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2722.21,2723.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's good because it provides a home for something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2723.82,2726.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we wanna protect.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2726.2,2728.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Others, other reasons that people give for prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2728.05,2731.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are instrumental in a less transparent way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2731.07,2734.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We might say, for example that prairies give us","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2734.35,2737.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a proper sense of humility by reminding us how small we are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2737.22,2741.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They show us how big the sky is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2741.18,2743.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how complex a system of interconnected","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2743.41,2746.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"long range life cycles nature can devise.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2746.63,2750.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In short, we describe that prairie","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2750.44,2752.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"almost as a combination of a laboratory","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2752.43,2754.577"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and a museum for us to study some of these facts.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2754.577,2758.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It teaches us for example, to avoid superficial rigid","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2758.66,2763.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and anthropocentric judgments like fire is bad.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2763.43,2767.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It serves as a good.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=2767.1,2768.333"}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27397/annotation/811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/027/397/original/AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_a.vtt?1622148384","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/027/397/original/AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_a.vtt?1622148384"}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27398","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_a.txt [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639/transcript/27398/annotation/812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"- University and the Research Administration Office is the sponsor of the Bioethics Program that I would say. I wanna say just a little bit about the Bioethics Program, so you can see how this activity tonight fits into it. In the late 1980s, the Iowa legislature provided additional funding in fact. quite a substantial amount of extra funding for Iowa State University to work in the area of biotechnology and a part of that was to finance a building the molecular biology building on campus and there were lots and lots of dollars put into the program here and much of it originally coming out of the lottery funds and as they did that, as they moved into this biotechnology realm, the legislature at least sufficient number of them felt it was important to discuss or have a concern for the ethics of what was being done in biotechnology. And so the university agreed to set aside a certain amount of the money for biotechnology into a Bioethics program. In the first years of the Bioethics program here, the focus was on essentially assembling data, information from all kinds of sources all across the country and around the world. And then in the fall of 1989, the Vice-Provost for research Patricia Swann decided to turn the focus inward for awhile to see what we could do on the campus itself. Professor Gary Comstock of the Philosophy Department at Iowa State was put in charge of the program and he really is the one who has managed this program for the last four years. The on-campus program then has taken the form of a fall colloquium. So this will be the Fourth Annual Colloquium on Bioethics and a early summer or late spring depending on how you look at it. Institute in which you have approximately 25 faculty members from the biological sciences and other related areas, get together for a full week and discuss ethical issues. In both the colloquium and in the summer institute, a major aspect of the process is to have debates about ethical issues where we take experts who take polar positions on a particular issue to illustrate the great breadth of ethical issues that do arise when we talk about biological topics in general biotechnology in specific terms. So tonight we will have our Fourth Fall Colloquium in a debate format and we hope it will be a friendly debate. These people will take positions rather at odd, at odds with each other and go at it. So that's the purpose, the on-campus program we feel has been very successful this year, instead of having a Fourth Summer Institute, we are spending our time and energy evaluating the institutes the previous three years and then we hope to work off that next year in perhaps a new direction or perhaps to strengthening and continuing in the areas that we feel have been very successful. So, I'm happy to be hosting the fourth Annual Colloquium on Bioethics and I now wanna turn the podium over to Professor Richard Fumerton in Philosophy Department who will introduce the topic and the debaters.\r\n\r\n- I'm recognizing and I'm pleased to see you all here tonight. And Gary Comstock, it gives me a nice opportunity every now and then to be associated with this program and I really enjoy that. I should say at the outset that Gary Comstock came into this program in a context which involved changing of leadership, people leaving the university and a circumstance of a drift could have occurred but Gary came in and took over the program and the result has been a very gratifying outcome to this point in time and we're confident beyond. This evening's meeting, if it were looked at from the standpoint of undergraduate pedagogy, has to do with the idea that contrary to popular opinion and general views about these matters, there is a connection between the way people act and the way people think. That essentially is what philosophy is all about from my perspective and you'll see as you listened to the participants in this debate that what underlies the perspectives they take is not some esoteric theoretical dispute but essentially and ultimately a debate that has to do with what difference does the discussion concerning the possible instrumental value of p have to do with the way in which we might conduct ourselves as enlightened and disenlghtened citizens. I'm pleased to introduce in the reverse order in which they will appear, first, I'd like to introduce Doctor Lilly-Marlene, who is an associate professor of philosophy at Purdue University, Lilly-Marlene Russow received her PhD from Princeton and her main research interests are in the areas of ethics and animals, philosophy of mind and environmental ethics. She's done a lot of writing and is well known and her colleague Baird Callicott is equally accomplished. He's a professor of philosophy and the coordinator of letters and science. The letters and sciences program at the, in the environmental studies program at the University of Wisconsin at Stevens point and he's on the editorial board of a publication as well known in the country the environmental ethics publication. He's one of the people who perhaps the best, the person who knows best Aldo Leopold done a great deal of research with regard to Leopold and he's the author of a well known book, \"In Defense of the Land Ethic.\" Each will take a different view with regard to the question does the Iowa prairie have an intrinsic value and I should point out to you that you could put in the area of prairie virtually anything you wanted to do that has to do with the environment around us. It could be animals, it could be mountains, it could be rivers, it could be previce. Last before we start, the program is designed to go about an hour and a half, each speaker will take approximately 25 minutes at the end of the 225 minute presentations, there will be a rebate between the speakers and then following back they're eager to get into discussion with you and I know from being with them, their preference is to have discussion and in that respect to the debate atmosphere is something they will move away from, I'm guessing because they're interested in learning just as you are too. We'll stop about 9:30. It's my pleasure to introduce to you Doctor Baird Callicott.\r\n\r\n- Thank you very much, Dick, I'd like to tell all of you how much, how much honored I am to be invited here to Iowa State University. This is my second formal visit to Iowa State. I was here in 1987 at an event that was lasted several days and it was in this building in a number of the rooms Centennial celebrating the hundredth anniversary of Aldo Leopold's birth. Aldo Leopold is I'm sure all of you know being here for an environmental ethics event was the author of \"A Sand County Almanac\" which is sometimes referred to as the Bible of the contemporary conservation movement and Leopold is a native son of Iowa. He was born and raised in Burlington and so that's why this event was held here, it's organized by Tom Tanner. And so I feel sort of at home coming back, I'm glad to see so many of you have come out this evening on a Saturday night for an ethics event that's the night we usually reserve to try to be as unethical as we can but with within limits. But I'm sure that we're going to have a lively debate. I've been asked to address the question, does the Iowa Prairie have intrinsic value? Since the time of the ancient Greeks philosophers usually try to address specific questions by a circuitous route. First, we transform the specific question into a more general one, then only after we address the general question, do we return to the original question which we treat as a special case. To take an example that every sophomore is familiar with, suppose someone asks a philosopher is Socrates and since the original Socrates is of course, demonstrably moral, I'll make this a personal Socrates when we he's not yet dead and so we don't really know for sure in his case, his Socrates demopolis who let us hypothesize as a contemporary Greek American who owns a restaurant in Ames-mortal. The philosopher asks first are all men and mortal and addressing that question with inductive logic so far they all our, therefore all the rest must be as well. She draws the universal conclusion that indeed all men are more then observing that Socrates as a man. Our philosopher returns to the original question confidently concludes that yes Socrates is mortal. One example I'm sure you're all familiar with, so does the Iowa prairie have intrinsic value? Proceeding according to the pattern first it was just illustrated, let's ask more generally, do preference have intrinsic value whether they are in Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin, Kansas, Nebraska or wherever but even that question is not general enough for philosophers to want to try to address, prairie's are excellent examples indeed the first generation of ecologists regarded them as paradigm cases of biotic communities. Moving up another rung on the generalization ladder, we might ask, do biotic communities have intrinsic value but biotic communities or ecosystems as they were later called, are themselves only one sort of distinctly holistic biological entity. Species are another thus the actual question that has recently been debated, mooted and environmental philosophy is not do prairies have intrinsic value or even do biotic communities have intrinsic value but do some biological wholes as well as some biological individuals have intrinsic value. Now, the next thing that philosophers want to do after generalizing question posts to them, is to define the terms in which they are formulated. In the textbook example, men does not refer to male as opposed to female human beings it refers, you know, notoriously gender biased way to human beings irrespective of gender. And leaving up with another question, the question of life after death, mortal refers to somatic not psychic death. Similarly, in respect to the present question, I need to indicate what the term biological wholes refers to and what intrinsic value means. Species are fairly clear and straightforward cases of biological wholes, just as specimens are fairly clear and straightforward cases of biological individuals. The sperm whale is a biological whole, Moby-Dick is a biological individual just what these species maybe more precisely is not uncontroversial, our species abstract classes and this was traditional view. The more recent population biologists tend to regard them as sets of populations more reductively still as gene pools or some far out biologists regard them as supra-individual sort of protracted in space in time. However, species maybe technically defined that theoretical biology, in the philosophy of biology, we have a clear enough idea of what a species is to regard the current episode of abrupt mass anthropogenic species extinction as a cause for alarm. Just what a biotic community may be more precisely as if anything a matter of more controversy in theoretical biology and the philosophy of biology than what a species may be. But again, we have a clear enough idea of what a biotic community is to recognize the difference between a prairie and a cornfield and to regard the wholesale replacement of the former by the ladder as it calls in for alarm. What about intrinsic value? In intrinsic value maybe to find in contradistinction to instrumental value. The instrumental value of a thing is its usefulness to something or to someone else. Tools or paradigm cases of things, the value of which is exclusively instrumental. When a tool wears out, it becomes totally valueless except perhaps as material to be recycled. Each one of us human beings believes that his or her own total value exceeds his or her instrumental value that is his or her usefulness to family members, to friends, to employers and to society. Each of us believes in other words, that he or she has intrinsic value in addition to his or her instrumental value. That's the first approximation of what intrinsic value means is this, intrinsic value is the value left over after we subtract someone's or somethings instrumental value. What gives some things but not others value over and above their instrumental value? Various answers to this question have been proposed in the past. If some things have been created in the image of God and others have not, then a good case might be made that those created in the image of God have intrinsic value and those not so created don't have. But the image of God is a property, the possession of which cannot be ascertained by empirical means. Historically Western philosophers have sought a more secure and universally persuasive justification for their own claims and those of their fellow man as they once referred to the rest of us to possess intrinsic value. But at the same time, they wished self servingly to rule out claims made on behalf of non-human being. Preferring to follow them not Moses but Aristotle who characterized man that is the species more formerly named homosapiens as the rational animal, many Western philosophers Immanuel Kant is noteworthy as a noteworthy example, attributed intrinsic value to all rational beings, thus God, if God exists the heavenly host of angels if they exist, the immortal souls of somatically dead human beings, if they exist and somatically living human beings all have intrinsic value because all are putatively rational. Everything else has conveniently for us human beings at best only instrumental value. Unfortunately not quite all human beings are in fact, rational. Human infants, severely retarded, profoundly demented and abjectly senile people are not, therefore, if rationality is the intrinsic value conferring property, we should be able within the bounds of morality to treat these so-called marginal cases of humanity as we do all the other beings who are instrumentally but not also intrinsically valuable. We should be able to perform that is painful medical experiments on babies, the retarded and demented and make dog food out of the senile but even to suggest such things is outrageous and obnoxious and I would not have dared to do so except dramatically to make the point that rationality is to narrow a basis for intrinsic value. In order to include all human beings, the marginal cases in the class of beings that have intrinsic value, recently some philosophers Peter singer, most notably have suggested that the capacity to suffer is a more inclusive intrinsic value conferring property, more inclusive in deeds not because of all Sentient beings have intrinsic value, then not only will the human marginal cases have it, so will very wide range of animals and that of course is exactly what Peter said early animal liberationists had in mind all along. Singers powerful ploy, set other philosophers, other philosophers believing wider concerns to thinking. Why draw the intrinsic value line between beings that are sentient and those that are not. Non sentient animals and plants after all have interests, have goods of their own, which they try to fulfill. It makes sense in other words, to say that paving a parking lot around a tree is not in the trees interest, it's not good for it and their interests can be frustrated whether they consciously suffer there for them or not. They too plants as well as animals are striving potentially thriving beings no less than are we, shouldn't we therefore admit that they too have intrinsic value no less than do we. Environmental Philosopher Paul W. Taylor on the basis of such reasoning as this, concluded that all living things, all living beings have intrinsic worth which was only another, anybody called him inherent worth which is only another name for intrinsic value but also on the basis of just such reasoning, tailor explicitly and strictly limited inherent worth to individual living beings. On this account, biological wholes such as species and biotic communities, lack intrinsic value. Other philosophers have tried to extend Taylor's account of intrinsic value to species and ecosystems on the decidedly shaky supposition that species are spatially and temporally protracted super individuals and that ecosystems have interests in the same way that organisms do. But the weight of opinion and evolutionary biology and theoretical ecology does not support such eccentric characterizations of species and ecosystems. So returning to the original question, does the Iowa prairie have intrinsic value? This line of argument leaves us not only with a negative conclusion but with unplausible and implausible alternative conclusion. In general, all individually living things have intrinsic value but no biological wholes have it. Therefore, the prairie community has no intrinsic value, neither has it's several species such as big bluestem, Indian grass, compass plant, round-headed bush clover, lupine and butterfly weed to mention but few, but it's individual components have it. This stalk of bluestem, this stalk of Indian grass, this costus plant, this bush round-headed clover, this sprig of lupine and this particular butterfly weed that doesn't sound right, does it? Therefore we had better backup and take another tack. First let's diagnose the problem with the foregoing tack and ask how it leads to the implausible conclusion that all biological specimens individuals but no species or biotic communities wholes having intrinsic value. Each step seems sound enough. The image of God is not an empirical criteria, rationality is too exclusive, nonsentient living things also have interests in goods of their own. Perhaps we are looking for intrinsic value in the wrong place, in the valuees instead of in the valuers. Now a cornerstone of modern science and philosophy is the proposition that objective nature is value neutral value free. If we imagine that all subjectivity, all consciousness were obliterated at a single stroke then all value would disappear with it and only impassive phenomena would remain. Value is a verb, first and foremost and a noun only derivatively. Nothing actually has a value either instrumental or intrinsic, rather things are valued either instrumentally or intrinsically. Under this interpretation, the difference between instrumental value and intrinsic value is this, someone or something is instrumentally valuable when he, she or it is valued because he, she or it is useful to someone else, someone or something is intrinsically valuable when he, she or it is valued for his, her or its own sake. Now, each of us human beings values himself or herself intrinsically. That is, whatever it may mean to say that each of us values himself or herself instrumentally to the extent that we are useful to ourselves whatever that means, it is crystal clear what it means to say that we value ourselves intrinsically, that is to say for our own sake. More problematic is whether we value anyone or anything else intrinsically, I think we do. Who is prepared to be so cynical as to say that the only way that one human being values others is merely instrumental. That is values others only to the extent that they are useful to him or herself. The most unambiguous case is the way most parents value their child for its own sake. Further we believe that the hallmark of true friendship is that friends value one another intrinsically. If one quote, unquote, friend values another only instrumentally, he or she is no true friend. Is anyone prepared to say them, that true friendship is totally non-existent but if we can invalue our children and friends intrinsically then we can principle value anything under the sun intrinsically. Genuine humanitarians value all human beings intrinsically, some fervent anti-abortionists seem genuinely to value each and every human embryo and fetus intrinsically though some anti-abortionist not all judging by their views on welfare high taxes for quality education and capital punishment seemed to cease to value each and every child after it's born but that's enough just to see if we're waiting here. Animal rights advocates, animal rights advocates value animals intrinsically and some environmentalist value biological wholes, species and ecosystem intrinsically. We can value anything or even everything intrinsically but as a matter of fact, we don't actually value just anything or everything intrinsically. What is the general principle of discrimination? Why do we value a child, a friend, a nameless starving Somali though I think we're sort of running out of intrinsic value for them as according to the newspapers. A pet intrinsically but not a lamp or a brick. What sorts of things stimulate the intrinsic value center in our central nervous systems? In a second magnum opus, the deceptive man, Charles Darwin suggested that what stimulates what he called more quaintly our altruistic mortal sentiments was the recognition of fellowship and community. The mortal sentiments evolved, he argued in conjunction with human social evolution. No trial Darwin points out could hold together, if murder, robbery, treachery and so forth were common consequently such crimes within the limits of the same tribe or bad card branded with everlasting informe but excite no such limits, no such sentiments beyond these limits. The bond, the glue holding protohuman tribes together Darwin suggested where altruistic feelings of sympathy for fellow members and loyalty to the group as a whole. As time went on, human societies grew in size and complexity and with that process of social evolution, step for step, human beings recognized more and more fellow members and larger and larger communities. As man advances in civilization, Darwin concludes, in small tribes are united into larger communities, the simplest reason would tell each individual that he ought to extend his social instincts and sympathies to all the members of the same nation and personally unknown to him, this point being once reached, there was only an artificial barrier to prevent his sympathies extending to the men of all nations and races and quote, \"Today all human beings belong to a single human community, the global village, as well as to a variety of more circumscribed human communities. Those among us who are vividly aware that the most inclusive of our nested human communities is now global and scope are moved intrinsically to value all our fellow human beings irrespective as we say of race, creed and nationality. Humanity, we value humanity as such and we value human civilization. Not only did Darwin foresee the time when universal human rights would be widely acknowledged, he foresaw the emergence of animal rights, quote, \"Sympathy beyond the confines of man that is humanity to the lower animals he notes seems to be one of the latest moral acquisitions. This virtue, one of the noblest which man is in doubt seems to arise incidentally from our sympathies becoming more tender and wildly diffused until they extended, they are extended all Sentient beings of course. Now I beg to differ here with Darwin and only one small particular. sympathy for animals is not in my opinion an incidental spillover of our moral sentiments, it arises rather because we recognize the kind of fellowship in community with others. The sense of fellowship that comes from our realization that we and many other animals are members of the community of sentient beings. But how does all of this help us to address the general question with which we began? Now we formulate it in light of a more scientific understanding of intrinsic value, are some biological wholes as well as some biological individuals intrinsically valuable. Human beings and sentient animals are biological individuals and Darwin helps us to understand why upon recognition of various social ties, upon recognition of various bonds of fellowship and community, we would and should intrinsically valuable. and ecosystems as such? More particularly what about such species as big bluestem and lupines and what about ecosystems like the Iowa prairie? Well, first of all, it's important to recognize that Darwin noticed that the proper objects or targets of some of our altruistic moral sentiments are in fact social poles. Indeed according to Darwin our most basic and primitive moral sentiments were community oriented. We have now seen, he notes that, \"actions are regarded by savages and were probably so regarded by primeval man as good or bad solely as they affect the welfare of the tribe not that of an individual member of the tribe.\" We can sympathize and empathize only with our fellows, only with other individuals but we mostly identify with and feel loyal to the communities that we recognize ourselves to be members of. In one such community oriented moral sentiment and a very powerful one at that has a special name of its own, we call it patriotism. Patriotism or love of country is quite evidently not reducible to love of fellow citizens individually since the most ardent patriots, at least at this time in this country often hate the majority of their fellow citizens, especially those who are members of other races, religions or sexual orientations as we know from our debates about gays in the military. Aldo Leopold building upon the foundations laid down by Darwin, simply pointed out that he called you today, recognizes that we are members not only of the hierarchy of human communities, we are also members of a hierarchy of biotic communities. Acknowledgments of our membership in the hierarchy of biotic communities, Leopold believed would lead us to develop a land ethic and a land ethic according to Leopold wrote, \"Changes the role of homosapiens from conqueror of the land community to plan member and citizen of it. It implies respect for his fellow members and also respect for the community as such. Respect as a moral attitude that we hold only for entities that are ends in themselves. We do not respect automobiles or other things which though highly valued are valued only as means only instrumental that is we respect only intrinsically valuable entities.\" As Leopold wrote, \"It is inconceivable to me that an ethical relation to land can exist without love, respect and admiration for land and high regard for its value. By value I of course mean something far broader than be of economic value, I mean value in the philosophical sense, I quote and by value in the philosophical sense, Leopold could only mean what we philosophers called intrinsic value. So, once again, does the Iowa prairie have intrinsic value? It doesn't have intrinsic value.\" In the same way that it has a deep root system. As I understand it, value is not an independently existing object of property. The, excuse me, the Iowa prairie is rather intrinsically valuable. Something that we can and should value for its own sake. Why? Because it is a type and a very paradigmatic type of that, of a biotic community and from an ecological point of view, we human beings are members of hierarchically organized biotic communities no less than we are members of hierarchically organized human community. Most of us intrinsically value the ladder. We value intrinsically our families, our home towns and cities, our countries, if we're patriotic and global human civilization. And to the extent that we are biologically literate, to the extent that we have absorbed the wider implications of the theory of evolution and the principles of ecology, we ought intrinsically value the former forest prairie's lakes and streams, marine communities and the biosphere in which we live, move and have our being. Further we intrinsically value the component species of intrinsically valuable biotic communities. According to Leopold, they should continue to exist as a matter of biotic right regardless of the presence or absence of economic advantage to us. Well, that's my understanding of how the Iowa prairie is intrinsically valuable and thank you very much for your attention this Saturday evening.\r\n\r\n- Well, I do want to thank you for inviting me here, and I'd like to thank Professor Callicott for doing a really admirable job of explaining and then illustrating how philosophers approach questions such as does the Iowa prairie have intrinsic value. Just to sort instead of summarize where we are so far, the conclusion he reaches might be summarized this way, he wants to say yes the Iowa prairie is a biological whole, which we can and should value for its own sake not just for the usefulness that it might have to something or someone else. Now, what I wanna try to convince you of is that there are two major claims, two major problems with the claim that the Iowa prairie has intrinsic value and that these problems are serious enough that we really can't yet accept Professor Callicott conclusion. In short, I think that the prairie does not have intrinsic value. Now before going any further, let me sort at least fictitiously or imaginatively brandish my nature conservancy card and tell you that I'm a great fun of prairies. I support them, I'm not saying that they're not important or valuable in any sense whatsoever. My concern is really just with the philosophical underpinnings of that sort of claim. The claim that the prairie constitutes a biological whole and that its value it's of a very special kind, namely intrinsic value. I'm going to focus specifically on the question of primaries rather than ecosystems in general. So some of my arguments will apply only to prairie's but I think that it's important to look at the philosophical underpinnings not just the goals. Light-minded people can all agree on goals but that's not good enough. We need to figure out what the best possible reasons are that we can give in supporting that view and perhaps persuading those who might not yet have seen the light. So let's start with the basic concept of intrinsic value. First of all, I'm going to agree fully with Professor Callicott, some of Professor Callicott general views on value. Namely that we have to start asking questions about value by looking back to the valuer, we're not gonna find it out there in the world independently of those who value it. We can't just look for some elusive property. And moreover, I think is very specific strategy for identifying when we've hit intrinsic value as opposed to other kinds is a very good one. He wants to tell us to look for what's left over once we subtract all the instrumental values and see if there's something else of value that's still left. But I think we have to go at least one step further. Now to claim that something has value of whatever sort whether we're talking about intrinsic or instrumental in this context, is not just a claim that some valuer somewhere in the world for whatever reason, attaches importance to that thing, indeed that may not even be a necessary condition. Professor Callicott and I and I hope everyone who addresses this as an ethical question, speaks of not just any object that happens to be an object of moral sentiment but the proper object of moral sentiment. And he insist that not only are prairie's things that some of his value but it's something that we should value now. Now, but if we wanna make claims like this about the proper object of value and what we should value, we better give reasons to support those claims. Going back to one of Callicott examples, Peter Singer gives reasons to show why he thinks we should recognize all sentient beings as intrinsically valuable. And professor Callicott talked a bit about what his reasons were. Now this same point about needing to give reasons is going to apply to any kind of value, instrumental as well as intrinsic. If I wanna just claim that this is a good lecturing, I should be able to give some reasons for what makes it a better lecturing than others that might be around. So, when we turn to the case of prairie's then, we've got to be prepared to support our prescriptions of value. We've got to be prepared to explain why we think they should be valued. Now the need for good reasons is especially clear in dealing with someone who fails to recognize the value of the prairie. The developer who sees a prairie as a fine place for a housing development, a shopping mall or a well-manicured golf course, for example. However this special need of persuading our political opponents or those who disagree with us, shouldn't obscure the fact that even among people who agree about goals, who agree that prairies are good things, we need to give reasons to support intrinsic of value. And I think that Professor Callicott hasn't really told us the whole story about his reasons for thinking that the Iowa prairie has intrinsic value. He's told us something, he's told us why he thinks we can value them because he says it's a community in which we live, It's a special kind of a community, a biotic community. But I'm sure that he doesn't think that any community in which we live should automatically be valued. So there's more work to be done. It's easy to find examples of social communities that for example are so repressive or so chaotic or so deadly to human flourishing and turn on the news just about every night and you'll find such things that its members, the members of such social communities might be quite justified and refusing to value them. We do often value our community but that's not a necessary, it's not necessarily true /that we should, in all cases and in the case of biotic communities too. The biotic, the immediate biotic community in which I typically live, consists mostly of soybeans and corn not bluestem grass or prairie species of any sort. Interspersed with patches of Kentucky bluegrass, asphalt, pavement and houses. Should we say that this isn't a community at all or that we have some reasons for not assigning it the same kind of value that we assigned to other sorts of biotic communities? That's the question I think we need to ask and that's where I think the problems arise. Now, certainly we were to do a survey, it would be fairly easy to generate lots of reasons for valuing the Iowa prairie. They're not hard to come by. Some of the reasons however, once we start looking at them are straightforwardly instrumental and Professor Callicott own criteria. So for example, if we justify protecting ecosystem like a prairie because it provides the habitat in which species which we wish to preserve can survive, that's an instrumental value. It's good because it provides a home for something that we wanna protect. Others, other reasons that people give for prairies are instrumental in a less transparent way. We might say, for example that prairies give us a proper sense of humility by reminding us how small we are. They show us how big the sky is, how complex a system of interconnected long range life cycles nature can devise. In short, we describe that prairie almost as a combination of a laboratory and a museum for us to study some of these facts. It teaches us for example, to avoid superficial rigid and anthropocentric judgments like fire is bad. It serves as a good.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115639#t=0.0,2773.152"}]}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 2 of 2 - AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_b.mp3"]},"duration":2717.976,"width":640,"height":40,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/115/640/small/lecture.png?1622148387","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/content/2/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-iastate.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/115/640/original/AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_b.mp3?1622148387","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":2717.976,"width":640,"height":40},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_b.vtt [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=5.39,6.443"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But of course we might find yet other reasons on our list","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=7.41,11.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that seem to impute intrinsic value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=11.76,15.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a straightforward sense,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=15.01,16.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"such as the claim that prairies are simply beautiful,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=16.7,19.513"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"awe-inspiring.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=21.21,22.253"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Are those good enough to justify the claim","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=23.81,26.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they have intrinsic value?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=26.73,28.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Let's look a bit closer at that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=30.11,32.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the help of an imaginary dialogue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=32.25,35.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Suppose Joe says, \"I've been working for six years","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=35.71,40.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to restore the prairie on this piece of land,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=40.02,42.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it's finally starting to come together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=42.61,45.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Isn't it beautiful?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=45.31,46.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Joe seems to be talking about intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=46.63,49.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mary says, \"Yes, it's so much more diverse","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=49.7,52.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and interesting than a lawn,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=52.95,55.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you know, there aren't a lot of flowers,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=55.17,57.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and why don't we just spark it up with some,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=57.9,60.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"let's say purple loosestrife?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=60.59,62.58"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"After all, it would grow really well here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=62.58,65.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it's such a pretty color.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=65.05,67.087"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Joe, of course, is outraged at this suggestion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=68.3,71.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he says, \"You don't understand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=71.35,73.633"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The point here is to reestablish","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=74.61,76.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the original, authentic prairie plants","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=76.5,79.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and to keep out exotics like purple loosestrife.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=79.74,82.367"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mary says, \"Well, what's the big deal about exotics?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=84.07,87.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now that we have access to more variety,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=87.74,90.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"why not take advantage of it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=90.22,92.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"After all a painter doesn't have to limit herself","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=92.48,95.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the materials that she can gather","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=95.67,97.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"around her own neighborhood.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=97.36,99.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"She takes advantage of anything","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=99.86,101.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that will best fit her artistic vision.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=101.66,104.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why not do the same when you try to develop","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=104.54,107.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a beautiful landscape?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=107.07,108.447"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Joe, in one last desperate move, says, \"No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=109.44,112.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Authenticity is really important here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=112.52,115.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Besides, purple loosestrife is so invasive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=115.71,119.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it would choke out many of the native species","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=119.25,121.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and thus defeat the whole purpose.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=121.56,123.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mary says, \"Oh, okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=124.22,126.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So your prairie is good because it provides a place","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=126.36,129.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where certain species can survive in a protected location,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=129.65,133.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"protected from nasty things like purple loosestrife.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=133.21,136.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That of course is one of the instrumental values","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=136.5,138.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have already identified.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=138.71,140.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But authenticity, why is that important?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=140.85,143.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Not because it makes the prairie more beautiful, but why?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=143.69,148.077"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, there's a sense in which Mary is saying,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=149.66,152.697"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"I don't get it.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=152.697,154.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Her suggestion about purple loosestrife reveals that much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=154.27,158.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"However, she's right to be suspicious","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=158.4,162.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of any kind of glib assertion of intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=162.44,167.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They don't always fit with what is ultimately said","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=167.15,170.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be important about prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=170.18,172.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be in the prairie's interest,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=172.26,174.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or to make the prairie better or worse.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=174.15,176.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why are authentic prairies better than prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=176.76,180.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that have non-native species?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=180.88,183.093"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Those values feed into the earlier sorts of reasons","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=185.13,189.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that led us to think that these reasons","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=189.31,191.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"were ultimately instrumental.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=191.2,193.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They make us feel more connected with our historical roots,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=193.2,196.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they illustrate a particular ecosystem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=196.26,199.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that was once widespread, and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=199.68,201.973"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, I've only been able to look at a very few","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=203.72,206.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the candidates for reasons to value the Iowa prairie.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=206.3,211.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it would certainly be impossible to go through","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=211.21,213.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all the lists of all the reasons that anybody might give.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=213.41,217.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Indeed, it's probably going to be the case","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=217.61,219.84"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that our reasons for valuing prairies are very complex","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=219.84,224.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and involve a combination of reasons.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=224.29,226.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think at this point, the burden of proof lies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=227.67,231.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with those who defend the claim","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=231.67,233.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the Iowa prairie has intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=234.35,237.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Produce please, an explanation of this claim,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=237.89,241.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a reason for valuing the prairie,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=241.36,242.365"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that will withstand the closest scrutiny","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=242.365,243.198"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that revealed the other reasons we did look at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=243.198,244.031"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to turn out to be instrumental.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=244.031,249.031"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, so far my conclusion, pending further replies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=252.93,257.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from Professor Callicott or the audience,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=257.73,261.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that the reasons typically given for valuing prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=261.15,265.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"perhaps all once we complete the job of unpacking them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=265.03,268.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rest on the instrumental value of a prairie.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=268.21,271.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They remind us of something important,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=271.87,273.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they teach us valuable lessons,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=273.71,275.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they illustrate something about biotic communities,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=275.76,278.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=278.49,279.333"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Should I be worried about this?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=280.23,282.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Should I think, \"Oh my gosh,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=282.44,283.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm opening the doors for the bulldozers\"?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=283.65,286.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't think so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=286.34,287.313"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we can see why, if we look more closely at the contrast","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=288.44,291.16"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between instrumental and intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=291.16,294.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Professor Callicott's example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=294.51,295.507"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of things with instrumental values,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=295.507,296.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are things like tools, automobiles,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=296.34,297.173"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"lamps, bricks, and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=297.173,302.173"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And those might give the impression that when we say","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=303.59,306.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that something has merely instrumental value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=306.45,309.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we're saying that it's prosaic, mundane,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=309.63,310.625"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"purely economic and not very sensitive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=310.625,315.625"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I don't think that that's the right way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=317.39,318.413"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of looking at things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=318.413,320.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Some things, and libraries, I think are a good example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=320.9,324.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have great instrumental value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=324.51,325.499"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just because they make possible","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=325.499,327.396"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what is best and finest in us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=327.396,330.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To conclude that something merely has instrumental value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=330.73,334.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"should not denigrate it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=334.41,335.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It can be instrumental in supporting very important values","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=335.78,340.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and certainly non-economic values.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=340.11,342.253"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Nor does labeling something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=343.36,344.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as merely instrumentally valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=344.34,349.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"mean that it's somehow less important","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=349.41,351.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"than things that are intrinsically valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=351.87,354.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's not the case that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=354.63,355.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sort of intrinsically valuable things go up there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=355.63,358.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and merely instrumentally valuable things always rank lower.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=358.44,363.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Some things, and here food is a good example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=363.11,366.233"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have a great instrumental value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=370.195,371.028"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have great instrumental value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=371.028,371.861"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because they're absolutely necessary to sustain life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=371.861,375.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In many cases, in cases of food, for example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=375.54,378.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we may be quite right in sacrificing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=378.86,379.871"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something of intrinsic value in order to obtain the food,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=379.871,384.871"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is merely instrumentally valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=386.38,388.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but which keeps us alive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=388.3,390.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"An artist might sell her paintings","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=390.35,392.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to feed her children, for example.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=392.97,395.373"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the same thing might be true with prairies.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=397.06,399.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, in light of this general reflection,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=400.79,403.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I've just been talking about some problems","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=403.75,405.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the concepts of instrumental versus intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=405.59,409.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And on some of the reasons that are commonly given","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=409.46,411.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to justify the valuation of prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=411.5,414.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think we just have to conclude","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=414.6,416.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the case hasn't been made yet","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=416.6,418.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they have intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=418.24,420.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It may well be, and I think it is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=420.73,421.632"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"instead the case that they have instrumental value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=421.632,426.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of a particularly pressing kind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=426.1,428.163"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"However, there's a second serious obstacle","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=429.27,433.04"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that also raises questions about the conclusion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=433.04,436.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that prairies have intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=436.06,438.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mentioned at the beginning that there were two,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=438.17,440.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"my concerns about intrinsic value was the first,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=440.52,443.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"here comes my second.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=443.61,444.713"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In order to say of any thing, call it X,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=445.85,449.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it has intrinsic value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=449.22,451.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one must have some very solid idea of what X is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=451.37,455.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or at least how to do identify it as an X.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=455.39,458.313"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thus, we must ask, \"What is a prairie?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=459.72,462.517"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Professor Callicott recognizes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=463.69,464.758"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the importance of this question","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=464.758,467.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but tells us, and this is a quote,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=467.81,469.767"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"We have a clear enough idea of what a biotic community is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=469.767,473.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to recognize the difference","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=473.61,474.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between a prairie and a cornfield.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=474.79,476.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And to regard the wholesale replacement","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=476.96,479.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the former by the later, also, as a cause for alarm.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=479.03,483.267"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sure, we can tell the difference","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=484.47,485.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"between prairies and cornfields, most of us,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=485.61,487.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I'm not sure that that's good enough.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=488.83,490.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We need to look more closely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=490.85,492.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There are two facts about prairies, as opposed to 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today,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=684.39,686.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for intrinsic value to apply to something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=686.29,689.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that thing would have to be a whole, would need integrity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=689.07,693.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in a fairly robust and self-sustaining way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=693.43,697.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Therefore, we need to ask too whether prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=697.06,700.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are more like families or more like zoos?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=700.26,702.99"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do they have the right kind of wholeness?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=702.99,705.313"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sadly, I think that at least as they exist today,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=706.49,710.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"prairies in Iowa and most other states are more like zoos.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=710.15,715.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The conclusion is based on exactly those two facts","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=715.46,718.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I mentioned earlier,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=718.14,719.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they're existing as restorations with very limited scope","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=719.66,722.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the need for human management,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=722.88,725.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the natural consequences of those two facts.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=725.06,728.053"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the dilemma I want to pose for Professor Callicott's view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=729.03,733.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that either we admit that not all communities","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=733.13,736.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have wholeness in the right sort of sense,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=736.51,739.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in which case Professor Callicott's argument","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=739.49,742.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for intrinsic value may not apply to them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=742.28,744.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or we restrict the term community to only those wholes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=744.92,749.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which do have the internal integrity that's necessary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=749.57,752.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to bind these things together into a unit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=752.64,755.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But if we take that second choice,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=755.68,758.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"our two facts about prairies suggest","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=758.76,761.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that prairies won't count as communities","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=761.2,763.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in this more restricted sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=763.29,765.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And once again, we don't have any 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value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=770.43,772.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, perhaps when Aldo Leopold looked at prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=772.95,776.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some were still large enough and original enough","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=776.96,780.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to be complete ecosystems, not just a catalog of plants,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=780.49,785.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but the birds that feed on them and spread the seeds,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=785.67,788.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the butterflies that were specially adapted","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=788.79,791.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to fertilize or pollinate this sort of plant,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=791.25,796.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the grazers that prevented the overgrowth of larger plants,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=796.77,801.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the predators that limit the population of grazers,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=801.08,803.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so on, and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=803.8,805.253"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, maybe when Ted Turner gets finished with Montana","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=806.16,809.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the buffalo and perhaps the wolves","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=809.69,811.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that he might bring in after that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=811.8,813.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he'd turn his attention to the Iowa prairie","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=813.53,815.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it can be that way again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=815.9,818.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But prairies as we have them and value them today","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=818.17,822.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"fall far, far short of that kind of completeness and unity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=822.8,827.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The Iowa prairie may have a few dickcissels","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=827.8,830.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but they also have their share of English sparrows.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=830.14,832.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The little pockets of prairies are inevitably surrounded","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=832.97,836.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by suburban or urban environments","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=836.43,838.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that disrupt the purity and integrity of the prairie.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=838.69,841.713"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The problem is not just one of size,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=842.86,846.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"although size and scale is an important factor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=846.03,849.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Restoration, even on a grand scale,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=849.96,852.83"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"raises questions about unity, integrity, and identity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=852.83,856.713"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When an ecosystem evolves gradually and naturally,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=857.64,861.053"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it in a sense defines its own identity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=862.33,865.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The plants and animals in the system belong there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=865.21,868.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they're legitimate members of the community,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=868.0,870.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they evolved as part of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=870.07,872.19"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"By definition two, the species that aren't represented","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=872.19,875.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in that system aren't really part of the system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=875.4,878.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So in that sense, the evolution defines the identity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=878.51,882.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"On the other hand, when we set out to restore a prairie,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=882.5,885.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have to decide what belongs in it and what doesn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=885.69,888.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We have to make that decision.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=888.94,890.593"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In doing that, we rely in part on historical records,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=891.59,895.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but those are often incomplete or inaccurate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=895.73,898.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We also try to examine the few bits of original prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=898.53,902.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we can still find,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=902.24,904.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but that's a process like trying to understand gorillas","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=904.12,907.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by looking at a single gorilla in a barren cage","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=907.02,909.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the Central Park Zoo.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=909.64,911.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And even that assumes that we've got a label on our cage,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=911.8,915.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we can recognize an original prairie when we find it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=915.08,918.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we can distinguish between the indigenous life","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=918.69,922.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the exotics that have contaminated it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=922.5,925.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What are the odds that we're getting this right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=925.46,928.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that they're not that good.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=928.07,930.633"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Finally, and I have only time to raise the question","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=932.04,934.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I'm not gonna explore it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=934.52,935.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"although perhaps we can do so in the discussion period.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=935.7,938.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How do we factor in human influence","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=939.35,941.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"into the biotic community?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=941.62,943.163"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is particularly a concern with prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=944.21,946.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"since prairies need to be burned periodically,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=946.87,949.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something that has required human intervention","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=949.62,951.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for a long time, including burning by Native Americans","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=951.93,955.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"before European settlers got here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=955.85,958.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Most prairies also require some sort of weeding,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=958.64,962.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in some way, to eradicate exotic species","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=962.62,965.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that inevitably contaminate it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=965.68,968.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How much do these considerations affect and undermine","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=968.15,971.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the identity of prairies as biotic communities?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=971.11,974.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think it makes their identity more dependent on us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=974.43,977.843"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To sum up, because many apparently intrinsic values","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=979.02,983.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"turn out to be instrumental","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=983.69,985.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when we look at them more closely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=985.07,987.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And also because it's not clear that prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=987.08,989.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"today at least, have the sort of wholeness or integrity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=989.41,993.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that makes them even potential objects","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=993.18,995.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of value in their own right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=995.23,997.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have to conclude that prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=997.21,998.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"do not have intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=998.68,1001.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That doesn't mean we should not preserve and cherish them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1001.21,1004.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it does mean that we need a different moral foundation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1004.29,1007.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and justification for that preservation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1007.5,1010.129"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1010.129,1011.671"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(audience clapping)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1011.671,1014.671"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e We've decided because of the time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1017.83,1019.42"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to go right into comments and questions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1019.42,1022.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what we'll do is I'll sort of umpire.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1022.05,1023.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'll point at you, and then you've got the floor","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1023.93,1026.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and identify the person with whom you'd like to talk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1026.3,1028.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mike?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1028.71,1029.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e (indistinct)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1029.77,1032.353"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We're given the assumption of beauty","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1033.922,1036.612"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from some of your earlier discussion,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1036.612,1037.621"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems like you've given us a test","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1037.621,1040.498"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the way something is intrinsically valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1040.498,1044.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And let me see if I got this right,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1044.91,1047.631"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what those tests are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1047.631,1050.205"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The first one is that something X would not be valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1050.205,1054.992"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if it's possible that adding more X would not be valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1054.992,1059.992"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, for example, in the discussion of beauty,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1061.21,1064.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it would not be valuable to make a prairie more beautiful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1064.66,1067.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by adding those flowers, and therefore beauty","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1067.35,1070.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"isn't particularly, that can't be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1070.65,1072.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what makes this intrinsically valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1072.81,1074.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Your second criteria of when something would be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1074.82,1078.144"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"intrinsically valuable is the (indistinct)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1078.144,1080.236"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would not be complete or unified.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1080.236,1082.631"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And given the, assuming these are the two tests","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1082.631,1085.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you want to propose, I'm wondering whether anything","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1085.62,1088.141"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is intrinsically valuable in your opinion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1088.141,1091.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay. I think that, let me take the second one first.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1091.64,1096.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That test is something that I took","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1097.79,1100.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from Professor Callicott.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1100.29,1102.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is, he wants to say that one way of showing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1102.23,1105.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that something is at least a possible object for value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1105.39,1109.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is to show that it's a community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1109.2,1111.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think that that sense of community that he's evoking","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1111.13,1114.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"implicitly requires some sort of wholeness and integrity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1114.79,1117.427"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and in fact, I think he would agree","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1117.427,1120.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that integrity plays an important role in defining that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1120.11,1123.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'm just using his test there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1123.22,1125.373"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now let's see, the first one, that wasn't my intention.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1126.34,1129.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The reason I talked about purple loosestrife","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1129.66,1133.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and adding other flowers is that I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1133.73,1137.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that when we ask what makes something better or worse,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1137.8,1142.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that can give us a clue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1142.31,1144.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's sort of a tactical move.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1144.23,1146.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That can give us a clue as to why we value something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1146.72,1151.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So if, for example, I'm a coin collector","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1151.89,1155.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I automatically say, \"Well, the older one is better.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1155.98,1159.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That might give me a clue as to what it is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1159.06,1161.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I value about those coins.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1161.75,1163.443"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When we find out that getting rid of purple loosestrife","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1164.62,1167.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than adding it adds value to the prairie,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1167.78,1171.19"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"makes it better, that gives us a clue","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1171.19,1173.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as to why we value prairies.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1173.54,1177.04"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The real test.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1177.04,1178.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, that's just a clue for say,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1178.43,1180.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it turns out not to be variety in any sense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1180.08,1182.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but authenticity that we care about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1182.96,1185.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's what getting rid of the purple loosestrife gives us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1185.97,1189.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, the question is, is authenticity an intrinsic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1189.68,1193.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or an instrumental value?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1193.45,1194.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, do we value things as authentic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1194.85,1197.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because they enable us to do something else,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1197.13,1200.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"do something further?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1200.54,1202.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there, I think I'm following again","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1202.01,1203.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Professor Callicott's definition.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1203.88,1205.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what I was trying to do was just apply his tests,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1205.74,1209.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but show that things like authenticity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1209.11,1211.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"turn out to be valued not for their own sake,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1211.93,1214.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but because they, as I said,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1214.33,1217.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"get us closer to our historical roots","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1217.15,1219.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or illustrate an ecosystem that used to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1219.13,1221.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a very important part of this land and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1221.87,1224.703"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I would say that in the case of your first test","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1225.6,1229.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's not a test that I wanna use,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1229.26,1231.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the way you described it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1231.41,1232.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Baird, do you have anything to go with that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1232.62,1234.026"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1234.026,1234.859"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Next.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1234.859,1235.692"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Michelle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1237.065,1238.062"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Professor Callicott, like professor Russow,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1238.062,1240.282"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm worried about your accounts of intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1240.282,1242.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You rejected rationality as a criterion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1242.92,1245.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for ascribing intrinsic value to something,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1245.41,1248.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I'm afraid that your account","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1248.36,1250.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of intrinsic value is gonna be too narrow, too,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1250.11,1252.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because it doesn't seem as though it would allow","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1252.75,1255.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the intrinsic value of a piece of art","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1255.0,1257.936"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or something like that, which we would normally say","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1257.936,1261.895"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has intrinsic value as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1261.895,1263.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"On the other hand, I'm afraid that if you give an account","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1263.71,1266.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of intrinsic value that would include things like that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1266.7,1268.863"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that aren't moving, it's going to be so broad","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1268.863,1272.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so hard to give a foundation for,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1272.07,1274.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you're gonna be winding up trying to defend the view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1274.68,1277.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that value is inherent to nature","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1278.59,1280.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which is just what you want to avoid.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1280.39,1282.229"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you have any response to that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1282.229,1284.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. I'm gonna take the easy way out in saying","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1284.82,1287.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I don't find art to be intrinsically valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1287.26,1292.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and this despite the fact that my dad is an artist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1292.497,1296.923"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I very much respect him","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1296.923,1299.023"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I very much value his painting, for example.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1301.294,1305.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We're sitting in an art gallery right now,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1305.34,1307.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so I've got to be careful what I say about this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1307.71,1310.727"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think that art is instrumentally valuable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1310.727,1313.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's a human artifact,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1313.6,1315.906"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's something that human beings make.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1315.906,1318.142"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think that its value is subordinate","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1318.142,1323.142"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the interest that we take in it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1323.74,1328.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Here's a test by the way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1328.86,1330.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or another test for justifying this,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1330.18,1332.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"off of the very first paper of environmental philosophy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1332.91,1337.263"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which was delivered, published in a very obscure place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1339.73,1344.603"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was at one of the World Conferences of Philosophy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1345.639,1348.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"held in Bulgaria.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1348.11,1349.423"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in the insets it has a Bulgarian publication date.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1350.257,1354.847"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It has been printed, however, in a recent anthology,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1356.528,1359.99"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by one of the paper's authors was Richard Sylvan","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1361.24,1366.126"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the paper was called,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1366.126,1367.376"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Do We Need a New Environmental Ethic?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1368.446,1372.117"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And someone, in that paper, proposes the following test.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1373.28,1378.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He called it the last person or last,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1379.24,1382.803"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"last group of people, the last society.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1386.09,1388.973"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the test is as follows,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1389.829,1393.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if, from the prevailing point of view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1393.93,1397.125"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where nature is concerned, it would not be wrong","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1397.125,1399.838"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the last person, as Sylvan from Australia puts it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1399.838,1404.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to lay about destroying all other natural things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1404.59,1409.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now let's apply this to art.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1411.76,1413.873"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Would the last person do something ethically wrong?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1415.23,1418.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If there was only one last, suppose that some,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1418.69,1421.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that AIDS or something like that becomes uncontrollable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1423.98,1427.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"spread through the entire population,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1427.82,1430.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"becomes an airborne virus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1430.77,1433.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we have the last person left alive on the planet,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1433.72,1438.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who goes into the Louvre","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1438.47,1440.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and begins destroying the paintings there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1440.43,1445.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I would say that the last person does nothing wrong.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1446.36,1450.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He's, you know, there's nothing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1450.3,1451.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's no ethical judgment here","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1451.86,1453.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because there are no future human beings","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1453.9,1456.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who will appreciate this art","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1456.62,1458.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and art without human appreciators is of no value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1458.75,1463.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"However, Sylvan says, and I agree,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1464.01,1467.123"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the last person would do something very wrong","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1467.123,1470.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if he or she were to go about destroying all the whales","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1470.54,1475.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or all the elephants, or all the redwoods and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1475.41,1478.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"All the other organic things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1478.49,1480.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or to take all the nuclear weapons","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1480.85,1483.181"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and set off a nuclear explosion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1483.181,1485.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in order to destroy as much life as possible","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1485.3,1488.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and see if he could take the rest","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1488.07,1490.83"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the living world with him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1490.83,1493.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'll accept your criticism,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1493.31,1498.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I am going to be giving up some things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1498.28,1500.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we wouldn't really take as intrinsically valuable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1500.95,1504.623"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in part in order to save my theory,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1506.2,1508.103"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but in part because it also agrees","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1509.6,1511.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with my intuitions about this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1511.66,1513.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Michelle, you wanna get in on it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1513.9,1514.953"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh, sorry, Lilly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1514.953,1516.323"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't think we maybe wanna get into it, Baird,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1518.69,1520.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I think that that criterion is inconsistent","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1520.92,1523.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with the account of value with which you began,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1523.61,1526.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about the intrinsic value in what valuers can value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1526.98,1530.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for its own sake rather than for something else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1530.97,1533.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't think that those two tests,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1533.41,1535.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that test, the test you just proposed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1535.55,1537.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will fit that definition,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1537.82,1539.153"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because according to the definition that you gave earlier,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1540.38,1544.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a painting is intrinsically valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1544.76,1548.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or intrinsically valued if we value the painting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1548.57,1551.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for its own sake, rather than for something--","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1551.13,1553.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e But I don't think we do,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1553.27,1554.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's the point I'm trying to make.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1554.2,1555.317"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think that we value it for the aesthetic experience","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1555.317,1559.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that it provides us, not for its own sake,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1560.36,1563.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just as we value, to be fair,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1563.91,1567.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"grading complicated things with trivial ones,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1567.86,1572.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we value ice cream because it gives us pleasure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1573.001,1578.001"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of a certain sort.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1578.87,1581.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Similarly, we value art for the same reason,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1581.0,1584.203"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and (indistinct).","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1584.203,1587.036"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's what (indistinct).","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1589.127,1593.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Next question or comment?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1593.15,1594.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes. What?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1594.96,1596.737"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Can anyone ever understand what they mean","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1596.737,1598.788"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by \"for its own sake\"?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1598.788,1600.621"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e I tried to provide some examples.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1602.1,1603.883"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think we have good examples right here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1604.92,1606.567"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm saying that art objects","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1606.567,1610.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are not valued for their own sake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1610.28,1612.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"However, the example, I did try to give a few examples","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1612.44,1615.267"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what humans do value for their own sake,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1615.267,1618.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems to me that the most clear case,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1618.44,1623.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at least for those of us who are parents","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1624.06,1626.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and perhaps for those of us who have parents,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1626.65,1629.09"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which would include everyone,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1629.09,1631.451"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the way parents value their children.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1631.451,1635.073"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, children can be for parents,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1635.073,1638.184"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a real nuisance in asset, they're expensive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1638.184,1642.623"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Lots of times they turn out to be rotten.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1643.69,1645.919"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(audience laughing)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1645.919,1648.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, and how many mothers of social misfits,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1648.0,1653.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and downright criminals,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1656.2,1659.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"nevertheless value intrinsically their children?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1659.26,1663.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Their children are useless to them, useless to society,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1663.97,1666.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so on and yet are valued for their own sake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1667.69,1671.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, this seems to be to me as clear of an example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1671.8,1676.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and this is my touchstone that I'm trying to suggest.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1676.68,1680.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes, we know what it is to value something for its own sake,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1680.22,1684.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for example the way parents value their children.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1684.81,1688.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then let's see if we can work out from that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1688.87,1692.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that sure footing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1692.48,1695.971"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And by way of analogy and similarity,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1695.971,1700.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are there other things that we can take this as a,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1700.86,1705.19"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as an experience that we have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1705.19,1708.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and also find ourselves valuing other things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1708.53,1713.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, in a similar way?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1713.85,1716.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Let me just follow up on that, okay?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1716.1,1717.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And push this between the two of you a little further.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1717.67,1720.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What would be the difference in the policies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1720.81,1724.38"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the government of the state of Iowa,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1724.38,1726.533"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"were you or Lilly, but not both,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1728.37,1733.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"advising the legislature and the government","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1733.4,1736.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with regard to policy concerning prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1736.78,1738.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the state of Iowa, what would be the difference?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1738.93,1740.62"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, the difference is this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1740.62,1742.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is a question that's been pressed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1742.8,1745.04"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by our colleague Brian Norton,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1745.04,1748.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who was also an ample essentialist, to say,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1748.37,1751.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things of a nature though having this full range","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1751.13,1756.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of instrumental values, which Lilly so nicely suggested,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1756.571,1761.571"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not just what would you call them, phenomenal objects","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1762.68,1766.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or something like that, to pedestrian things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1766.39,1769.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but that we instrumentally value nature","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1769.56,1773.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in all sorts of higher ways, for aesthetic,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1773.35,1777.193"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as an aesthetic resource, as a sacred place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1778.26,1783.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It transforms us, it makes us better and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1784.51,1787.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When we bring all of these values, instrumental values","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1787.41,1792.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to bear upon nature, our colleague Brian Norton suggests","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1792.17,1795.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we have what he calls the convergence hypothesis.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1795.66,1799.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the intrinsic value thesis","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1799.79,1802.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the instrumental value thesis","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1802.9,1804.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"converge in precisely the same policy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1804.77,1807.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So all of this dispute, and this is Norton's point,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1807.56,1810.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"though he is a philosopher, I regard him","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1810.48,1812.153"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a somewhat anti-philosophical philosopher,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1812.153,1814.873"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he says that all of this talk about intrinsic value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1815.83,1820.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is worse than a mere academic debate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1820.59,1825.084"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It distracts attention from the real issues","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1825.084,1829.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which are pragmatic in policy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1829.24,1830.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We shouldn't be here talking about how we value prairies,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1830.81,1835.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we should be trying to implement the values that we have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1836.86,1841.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and especially this notion","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1843.04,1845.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of intrinsic value is controversial.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1845.34,1847.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So let's leave that out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1847.79,1849.033"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the only divisive among environmentalists.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1849.033,1852.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And let's just go with conservative,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1852.9,1854.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anthropocentric and instrumental view.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1857.39,1860.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now I have, I think that Norton was dead wrong about this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1860.21,1865.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that there is a significant and a profound impact,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1865.25,1870.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"practical impact, that intrinsic value makes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1873.19,1876.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the policy arena.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1876.72,1878.72"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what does that impact?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1878.72,1880.3"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It shifts the burden of 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proof","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1890.74,1893.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from those who want to save prairies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1893.13,1896.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to those who want to appropriate and use them","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1897.51,1901.86"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for developmental purposes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1901.86,1903.94"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because if something has intrinsic value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1903.94,1908.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then it has a prima facie right or case to exist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1908.43,1913.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"If on the other hand, it's only instrumentally valuable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1913.5,1917.29"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then it has to compete head to head","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1917.29,1920.41"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with all of the other possible uses,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1920.41,1923.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all of the other instrumental uses.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1923.78,1925.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And generally, if it's a shopping mall","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1925.77,1928.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as opposed to a prairie then,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1928.17,1931.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and we translate all of our instrumental values,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1931.82,1935.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this is what economists do,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1935.47,1936.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they make a cottage industry out of this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1936.75,1938.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They, they put a dollar value on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1938.91,1941.68"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay, you find the prairie beautiful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1941.68,1943.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You find it a a place of solitude and spiritual inspiration.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1943.66,1948.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How much is that worth to you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1949.09,1951.58"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We can, we put a dollar value on art.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1951.58,1954.14"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Let's put a dollar value on our aesthetic experience","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1954.14,1957.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and then compare that with the economic benefits","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1957.37,1960.35"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of a shopping mall, and what's gonna happen?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1960.35,1962.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The shopping mall is gonna win","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1962.95,1965.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in practically each and every case,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1965.6,1967.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"unless we're talking about something so gorgeous,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1967.36,1970.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so traditionally cherished as the Yosemite Valley","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1970.12,1974.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or something like that, in which case then,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1974.82,1977.09"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"perhaps if we talk about all the tourist dollars and so on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1977.09,1981.45"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that go into it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1981.45,1983.03"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So if we say that it's intrinsically valuable","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1983.03,1985.187"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and if we can make a persuasive case for this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1985.187,1989.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that persuades the public, and we've done this,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1989.06,1991.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's a precedent for this, by the way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1991.93,1993.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the Endangered Species Act,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1993.39,1995.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then the burden of proof has shifted","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1995.43,1997.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to those who want to appropriate and use it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=1997.51,2001.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They have to prove that that they're,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2001.23,2005.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the instrumental values are so overwhelming","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2005.77,2008.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they cancel, or we can set aside the intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2008.85,2013.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Lilly, any reply?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2014.03,2016.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e I think that Baird is right in saying","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2016.36,2019.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that in terms of deciding which practical policies","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2019.26,2022.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we would both advocate, that it's not going to,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2022.85,2026.04"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"our philosophical differences","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2026.04,2027.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"aren't going to make much difference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2027.51,2029.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I disagree with him about the fact","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2029.08,2032.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that talking about intrinsic value versus instrumental value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2032.46,2036.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"should shift the burden of proof.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2036.12,2038.143"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is, it would be a justification","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2039.58,2042.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for shifting the burden of proof","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2042.46,2044.4"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"onto those who want to use, tear up the prairie.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2044.4,2048.023"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Only if we had this picture of instrumental value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2049.04,2052.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as somehow better, higher than all instrumental values.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2052.23,2057.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think in fact, both instrumental and intrinsic values","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2059.07,2062.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are gonna have to go head to head,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2062.51,2064.67"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which, in any kind of conflict,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2064.67,2067.74"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and the problem is gonna be as difficult","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2067.74,2070.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for one sort of value as for the other.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2070.53,2074.063"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, I put that in terms of it shouldn't hurt.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2075.83,2080.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that when we try to give reasons","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2080.43,2082.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to support our policies, explain how we think these things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2082.52,2086.96"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"these conflicts ought to be decided.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2086.96,2089.09"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We could go Madison Avenue and it may turn out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2089.09,2091.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that intrinsic value is a nice catch slogan,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2091.55,2094.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is gonna get people to vote.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2094.59,2095.99"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I don't think either Baird or I want to say","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2097.27,2099.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that in a good community,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2099.98,2102.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we manipulate the citizens that way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2102.8,2104.69"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we want to give the best possible reasons.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2104.69,2107.09"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think on that basis, we have to go back to,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2107.09,2110.17"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"does it make sense to talk in this way?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2110.17,2112.153"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Good.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2113.04,2114.16"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes, Margaret?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2114.16,2115.451"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e I have a question for Professor Russow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2115.451,2118.055"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You said and I'm inclined to agree,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2118.055,2119.773"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's not just to say that we do value things certain ways","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2119.773,2123.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but you have to say there's a proper object value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2123.2,2125.273"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you have reasons to back it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2125.273,2127.249"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now you have a suggestion (indistinct)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2127.249,2129.007"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I can see just how you cash that out","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2129.007,2131.2"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for things that have instrumental value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2131.2,2133.425"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the value of an object for (indistinct)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2133.425,2136.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I'm wondering how you would,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2136.37,2137.7"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/685","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what kind of reason you could give","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2137.7,2139.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for valuing something intrinsically,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2139.31,2141.99"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the theoretical framework that you use?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2141.99,2144.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, just sort of a general sort of disclaimer,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2144.81,2148.51"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I chose to sort of work within","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2148.51,2150.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what you're calling this objectivist framework,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2150.88,2153.098"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is looking at the value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2153.098,2154.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rather than for an objective value out there in the world,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2154.43,2156.79"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just so that we could have a starting point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2156.79,2159.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on which we both agree.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2159.02,2160.363"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just set that sort of very basic philosophical question","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2161.55,2165.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"aside for the time being.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2165.06,2166.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But from a subjectivist point of view, it may turn out,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2166.56,2169.73"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I think Baird's example","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2169.73,2171.53"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of a parent and a child is a good one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2171.53,2174.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It may just be a basic human reaction","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2174.56,2177.37"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we can tell, I think he would want to tell,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2178.84,2182.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sort of an evolutionary story about it, perhaps","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2182.56,2184.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I'll give him that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2186.04,2187.403"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there are probably, I think there are,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2189.18,2191.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"other sorts of situations in which that immediate sympathy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2191.59,2196.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"empathy, resonance, appreciation is just triggered in us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2196.27,2201.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there's simply you, you hit a base level value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2202.84,2205.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm willing to stick with that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2207.25,2208.36"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for the purposes of this discussion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2208.36,2210.78"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Does that take us, does it take us,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2210.78,2213.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from both of your perspectives, in this kind of a direction?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2213.05,2216.54"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ultimately the answer to the question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2216.54,2219.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how do you identify what is straightforwardly,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2219.52,2222.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or in your senses, intrinsically valuable,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2222.9,2227.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"has more to do with those who do the valuing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2227.05,2230.65"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and less to do with what is valued,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2231.8,2235.0"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when it comes to the matter of explaining exactly what it is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2235.0,2238.6"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that makes anything intrinsically valuable?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2238.6,2240.963"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e No, I don't think so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2242.36,2244.83"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that we, to come back to policy and so on,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2244.83,2249.83"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that what we're doing here in part is something for,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2251.04,2255.897"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm saying this for the benefit","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2255.897,2256.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the non-philosophers in the audience,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2256.98,2259.362"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something called meta-ethics.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2259.362,2260.812"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is to say, we're trying to identify here this,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2261.874,2264.627"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we're trying to say something about ethics","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2266.834,2269.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and what its foundations are, and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2269.22,2273.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that in policy debates, we assume these,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2273.39,2278.39"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"these foundations, we just, we don't,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2278.67,2283.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we don't talk about them, we know that we have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2283.08,2286.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that we value things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2286.24,2287.97"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that perhaps we're not clear about this,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2287.97,2290.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's why we do philosophy about it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2290.22,2291.583"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and try to make these things clear","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2291.583,2294.06"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and raise them to the surface.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2294.06,2295.33"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But these are sort of the assumed things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2295.33,2297.587"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the under the surface things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2297.587,2299.32"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They're very often not very well articulated and so on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2299.32,2303.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but nevertheless they're assumed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2303.61,2304.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so what we do is talk about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2304.48,2307.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the various objects that are candidates","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2308.83,2312.71"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for things that we intrinsically value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2312.71,2316.308"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there are some paradigm cases,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2316.308,2320.27"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"parents and their children, for example,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2320.27,2323.15"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"children as intrinsically valuable things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2323.15,2325.95"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then we have some problematic things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2325.95,2329.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/747","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Should we value something like other animals?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2329.48,2334.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/748","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then how do we address this issue?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2336.75,2341.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/749","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We've got animal rights people,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2341.24,2342.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/750","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what are they trying, how do they try and convince us?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2342.85,2346.98"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, they talk about animals.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2346.98,2349.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They talk about the capacities of animals.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2349.13,2351.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you guys see, about, let me see,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2351.81,2354.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think it was in about March last year,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2354.9,2358.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a Time Magazine cover with a chimpanzee on it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2358.24,2362.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was all about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2362.13,2364.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"how we undervalued animal mental capacities.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2364.25,2369.25"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we talk about animals.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2369.82,2371.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/759","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"These are the sorts of capacities that they have.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2371.55,2375.75"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/760","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And those happen to be the sorts of capacities","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2375.75,2380.05"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that, in my language here, sort of tickle our,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2380.05,2384.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"our intrinsic value nerve cells, so to speak.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2384.64,2387.9"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They stimulate in us intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2387.9,2392.46"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, as an environmentalist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2392.46,2394.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I want to go beyond the rather straightforward","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2394.8,2397.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and simple case of animals","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2397.77,2399.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I wanna talk about species and biotic communities.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2399.28,2403.61"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do they have the kinds of characteristics","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2403.61,2407.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that address our intrinsic value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2407.87,2412.87"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"dimensions of our nervous systems","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2413.9,2415.856"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e as it were?\nMike, go ahead.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2415.856,2417.437"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm very worried about basing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2417.437,2420.02"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"intrinsic value on evolution.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2421.854,2424.271"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It might turn out, after all, that E.O. Wilson was right,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2427.76,2430.586"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and our biological natures would make us","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2430.586,2435.275"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"extraordinarily speciesist, or extraordinarily sexist,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2435.275,2436.108"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"or maybe even extraordinarily racist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2439.1,2441.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now should this biological fact just happen to be the case,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2441.28,2445.76"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it seems to me that no one would want to adopt a view","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2445.76,2448.89"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of intrinsic value that made these things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2449.812,2452.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just because you have these,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2452.1,2453.59"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"these racist neurons or speciesist neurons,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2453.59,2457.44"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"nobody, I think would want to adopt","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2457.44,2458.825"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(indistinct) intrinsic value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2458.825,2461.176"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To me, those things actually are intrinsically shocking.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2461.176,2465.55"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, racists and sexists might well want to,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2465.55,2467.88"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but certainly I don't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2467.88,2469.793"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And certainly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2470.877,2472.044"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Right. But then the question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2472.897,2474.47"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but then Margaret's question comes back, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2474.47,2476.28"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, and let me try to answer it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2476.28,2478.705"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Obviously this is a problem,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2478.705,2480.11"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"obviously with a theory like mine, that I have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2480.11,2483.157"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have to think long and hard about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2483.157,2485.493"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that what you're assuming is,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2486.69,2490.77"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and Wilson, when he's had an opportunity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2490.77,2493.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to think about this correctly, to reflect on what he has,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2493.01,2498.01"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"feeling shocked when he knows what said about these things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2499.19,2501.31"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to someone enjoying their work, would also agree,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2501.31,2505.573"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that is that that such things are not hardwired.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2507.2,2511.097"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That is to say, that our moral, let me put it this way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2512.285,2517.285"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Our moral sentiments are under-determined.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2517.48,2520.12"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We come into the world conservative,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2520.12,2522.43"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I do think that we have,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2522.43,2525.64"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there is a sense of us, and an order of community,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2525.64,2529.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and that in order for there to be a sense of us,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2529.93,2532.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there's got to be an other, a them,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2532.23,2534.5"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that sort of outside our community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2534.5,2537.367"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the history of moral consciousness as Darwin reviews it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2537.367,2542.367"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I think that Ms. Whithall is building upon it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2543.1,2546.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is that we expand our sense of what it means to belong,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2546.49,2551.49"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"our sense of us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2551.5,2553.24"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We begin to include the people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2553.24,2555.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on the other side of the river","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2555.92,2557.26"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who used to be stigmatized as subhuman,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2557.26,2560.593"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and now we have come to an inclusive humanism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2561.741,2566.597"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The next step is animals and the environment and so on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2567.84,2572.84"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So where is the other?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2573.23,2575.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And this is what I call the Copernican concept.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2575.07,2579.117"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The Copernican dimension of the land ethic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2579.117,2581.34"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, we're now representing our planet","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2581.34,2584.63"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from the point of view of the moonshot","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2584.63,2587.761"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/823","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a community in a hostile sort of solar system and beyond.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2587.761,2592.761"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/824","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's the other, this is the community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2596.8,2599.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so we feel that we live on a cozy and small planet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2599.91,2604.91"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now all of this is what I call cognitively massaging","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2606.6,2611.409"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"our evolved sentiments.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2611.409,2614.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We're not hard wired for these sorts of,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2614.52,2617.883"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"traditional limitations on ethics entirely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2621.57,2624.57"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Lilly, jump in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2624.57,2625.48"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah. I think that, what I was gonna say to that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2625.48,2628.987"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and to what you were suggesting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2628.987,2630.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would also perhaps answer your question,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2630.81,2633.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and it gets back to the point that I made","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2633.08,2634.81"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the very beginning,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2634.81,2635.643"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that if we're gonna be talking about what we should value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2635.643,2637.66"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have to be prepared to give reasons.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2637.66,2639.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"As soon as you give reasons,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2639.92,2641.185"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you have to sort of play by the rules of reasons","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2641.185,2643.85"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and one of those rules is consistency.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2643.85,2646.22"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's the standard argument","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2646.22,2648.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"against sexism, against racism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2648.52,2651.8"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Singer tries to generate it, he used, extended it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2651.8,2655.08"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to an argument against speciesism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2655.08,2656.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/845","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it comes back to, once you've been forced","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2656.93,2660.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/846","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to articulate why you value X,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2660.93,2665.93"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether that value be intrinsic or instrumental,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2666.74,2670.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you then have to be prepared to accept the fact","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2670.52,2674.18"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that in order to be consistent,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2674.18,2675.56"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you have to value other things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2675.56,2677.52"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/851","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that have that same kind of characteristics.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2677.52,2680.297"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/852","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So again, I would agree with Baird in this sense,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2680.297,2683.21"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that when we start looking","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2683.21,2685.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for what sorts of things we value,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2685.07,2687.1"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have to look to the things we value","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2687.1,2689.82"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and why we value them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2689.82,2691.563"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think that that's going to also provide a bulwark","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2691.563,2696.07"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"against the sort of provincialism","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2696.07,2699.23"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/859","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that you were concerned about.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2699.23,2701.617"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/860","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e -:\u003c/strong\u003e It's the bewitching hour, 9:30.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2702.8,2705.13"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/861","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We'd like to thank Lilly and Baird for being our guests.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2705.13,2708.92"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/862","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we'd also like to thank you very much for coming.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2708.92,2711.84"},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/863","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Good night.\n(audience clapping)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=2711.84,2715.333"}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27399/annotation/864","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/027/399/original/AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_b.vtt?1622148389","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/027/399/original/AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_b.vtt?1622148389"}]},{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27400","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["AV204162_Does_Iowa_Praire_Have_Intrinsic_Value_b.txt [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640/transcript/27400/annotation/865","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"- Intrinsic value. But of course we might find yet other reasons on our list that seem to impute intrinsic value in a straightforward sense, such as the claim that prairies are simply beautiful, awe-inspiring. Are those good enough to justify the claim that they have intrinsic value? Let's look a bit closer at that with the help of an imaginary dialogue. Suppose Joe says, \"I've been working for six years to restore the prairie on this piece of land, and it's finally starting to come together. Isn't it beautiful?\" Joe seems to be talking about intrinsic value. Mary says, \"Yes, it's so much more diverse and interesting than a lawn, but you know, there aren't a lot of flowers, and why don't we just spark it up with some, let's say purple loosestrife? After all, it would grow really well here, and it's such a pretty color.\" Joe, of course, is outraged at this suggestion. And he says, \"You don't understand. The point here is to reestablish the original, authentic prairie plants and to keep out exotics like purple loosestrife.\" Mary says, \"Well, what's the big deal about exotics? Now that we have access to more variety, why not take advantage of it? After all a painter doesn't have to limit herself to the materials that she can gather around her own neighborhood. She takes advantage of anything that will best fit her artistic vision. Why not do the same when you try to develop a beautiful landscape?\" Joe, in one last desperate move, says, \"No. Authenticity is really important here. Besides, purple loosestrife is so invasive that it would choke out many of the native species and thus defeat the whole purpose.\" Mary says, \"Oh, okay. So your prairie is good because it provides a place where certain species can survive in a protected location, protected from nasty things like purple loosestrife. That of course is one of the instrumental values we have already identified. But authenticity, why is that important? Not because it makes the prairie more beautiful, but why?\" Now, there's a sense in which Mary is saying, \"I don't get it.\" Her suggestion about purple loosestrife reveals that much. However, she's right to be suspicious of any kind of glib assertion of intrinsic value. They don't always fit with what is ultimately said to be important about prairies, to be in the prairie's interest, or to make the prairie better or worse. Why are authentic prairies better than prairies that have non-native species? Those values feed into the earlier sorts of reasons that led us to think that these reasons were ultimately instrumental. They make us feel more connected with our historical roots, they illustrate a particular ecosystem that was once widespread, and so on. Now, I've only been able to look at a very few of the candidates for reasons to value the Iowa prairie. And it would certainly be impossible to go through all the lists of all the reasons that anybody might give. Indeed, it's probably going to be the case that our reasons for valuing prairies are very complex and involve a combination of reasons. But I think at this point, the burden of proof lies with those who defend the claim that the Iowa prairie has intrinsic value. Produce please, an explanation of this claim, a reason for valuing the prairie, that will withstand the closest scrutiny that revealed the other reasons we did look at to turn out to be instrumental. So, so far my conclusion, pending further replies from Professor Callicott or the audience, is that the reasons typically given for valuing prairies, perhaps all once we complete the job of unpacking them, rest on the instrumental value of a prairie. They remind us of something important, they teach us valuable lessons, they illustrate something about biotic communities, and so on. Should I be worried about this? Should I think, \"Oh my gosh, I'm opening the doors for the bulldozers\"? I don't think so. And we can see why, if we look more closely at the contrast between instrumental and intrinsic value. Professor Callicott's example, of things with instrumental values, are things like tools, automobiles, lamps, bricks, and so on. And those might give the impression that when we say that something has merely instrumental value, we're saying that it's prosaic, mundane, purely economic and not very sensitive. But I don't think that that's the right way of looking at things. Some things, and libraries, I think are a good example, have great instrumental value, just because they make possible what is best and finest in us. To conclude that something merely has instrumental value, should not denigrate it. It can be instrumental in supporting very important values and certainly non-economic values. Nor does labeling something as merely instrumentally valuable mean that it's somehow less important than things that are intrinsically valuable. It's not the case that sort of intrinsically valuable things go up there and merely instrumentally valuable things always rank lower. Some things, and here food is a good example, have a great instrumental value, have great instrumental value because they're absolutely necessary to sustain life. In many cases, in cases of food, for example, we may be quite right in sacrificing something of intrinsic value in order to obtain the food, which is merely instrumentally valuable but which keeps us alive. An artist might sell her paintings to feed her children, for example. And the same thing might be true with prairies. Now, in light of this general reflection, I've just been talking about some problems with the concepts of instrumental versus intrinsic value. And on some of the reasons that are commonly given to justify the valuation of prairies, I think we just have to conclude that the case hasn't been made yet that they have intrinsic value. It may well be, and I think it is, instead the case that they have instrumental value of a particularly pressing kind. However, there's a second serious obstacle that also raises questions about the conclusion that prairies have intrinsic value. I mentioned at the beginning that there were two, my concerns about intrinsic value was the first, here comes my second. In order to say of any thing, call it X, that it has intrinsic value, one must have some very solid idea of what X is, or at least how to do identify it as an X. Thus, we must ask, \"What is a prairie?\" Professor Callicott recognizes the importance of this question but tells us, and this is a quote, \"We have a clear enough idea of what a biotic community is to recognize the difference between a prairie and a cornfield. And to regard the wholesale replacement of the former by the later, also, as a cause for alarm.\" Sure, we can tell the difference between prairies and cornfields, most of us, but I'm not sure that that's good enough. We need to look more closely. There are two facts about prairies, as opposed to perhaps some other sorts of naturally existing objects, that make this problem especially hard for prairies. The first is that the prairies we have today in Iowa are often restored rather than original. And more importantly, they exist in very small isolated patches. The second problem with prairies is that typically they require quite a bit of human intervention to flourish and survive, at least in their present form. In order to understand why these raise difficulties, we need to look again at the general concept of what it is to be a biotic community, or any community, and why that's important for intrinsic value. Now, if I've understood Professor Callicott's position correctly, and I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines here, the notion of a community is sort of the glue that binds together a collection of individuals into a unit or a whole. This whole may be a family, a tribe, a nation, or an ecosystem. Thus he speaks of prairies as biological wholes, of ecosystems as one sort of distinctly holistic biological entity. We need something to weld these together into a unit. He also cites Darwin when he introduces the notion of social wholes as appropriate objects of value. The problem of course is that any community, whether you look at social community, mixed communities, or biotic communities, vary widely in the extent of what I may call their wholeness that is their own internally grounded integrity or identity. This is easy to illustrate in social communities. Contrast for example, a nuclear family which does have some sort of integrity or unity with the community that gets formed when I arbitrarily break the students in my logic class into groups of six for a group project. The same will be true of collections of plants and animals. A zoo or a safari park is a biotic community, albeit one whose scope, boundaries, members, and functioning are for the most part determined by outside forces. In that sense, the safari park is more like my logic group than like a family. The choices determining the shape of this sort of community might be arbitrary. Some will be better than others. What will be lacking is the intrinsic or internal integrity, the sense of wholeness that we need to sort of form the object or to identify the object that we value. Now, in the best of all possible worlds, all ecosystems would be more like families than like zoos or logic classes. Indeed, the notion of integrity that I've been using plays an important role in both Aldo Leopold's and Baird Callicott's ethical theories. In order for Professor Callicott's argument, at least the one he offers here today, for intrinsic value to apply to something, that thing would have to be a whole, would need integrity, in a fairly robust and self-sustaining way. Therefore, we need to ask too whether prairies are more like families or more like zoos? Do they have the right kind of wholeness? Sadly, I think that at least as they exist today, prairies in Iowa and most other states are more like zoos. The conclusion is based on exactly those two facts that I mentioned earlier, they're existing as restorations with very limited scope and the need for human management, and the natural consequences of those two facts. So the dilemma I want to pose for Professor Callicott's view is that either we admit that not all communities have wholeness in the right sort of sense, in which case Professor Callicott's argument for intrinsic value may not apply to them, or we restrict the term community to only those wholes which do have the internal integrity that's necessary to bind these things together into a unit. But if we take that second choice, our two facts about prairies suggest that prairies won't count as communities in this more restricted sense. And once again, we don't have any reason for thinking that they can't have intrinsic value, or that they do have intrinsic value. Now, perhaps when Aldo Leopold looked at prairies, some were still large enough and original enough to be complete ecosystems, not just a catalog of plants, but the birds that feed on them and spread the seeds, the butterflies that were specially adapted to fertilize or pollinate this sort of plant, the grazers that prevented the overgrowth of larger plants, and the predators that limit the population of grazers, and so on, and so on. Now, maybe when Ted Turner gets finished with Montana and the buffalo and perhaps the wolves that he might bring in after that, he'd turn his attention to the Iowa prairie and it can be that way again. But prairies as we have them and value them today fall far, far short of that kind of completeness and unity. The Iowa prairie may have a few dickcissels but they also have their share of English sparrows. The little pockets of prairies are inevitably surrounded by suburban or urban environments that disrupt the purity and integrity of the prairie. The problem is not just one of size, although size and scale is an important factor. Restoration, even on a grand scale, raises questions about unity, integrity, and identity. When an ecosystem evolves gradually and naturally, it in a sense defines its own identity. The plants and animals in the system belong there, they're legitimate members of the community, they evolved as part of it. By definition two, the species that aren't represented in that system aren't really part of the system. So in that sense, the evolution defines the identity. On the other hand, when we set out to restore a prairie, we have to decide what belongs in it and what doesn't. We have to make that decision. In doing that, we rely in part on historical records, but those are often incomplete or inaccurate. We also try to examine the few bits of original prairies that we can still find, but that's a process like trying to understand gorillas by looking at a single gorilla in a barren cage in the Central Park Zoo. And even that assumes that we've got a label on our cage, that we can recognize an original prairie when we find it, that we can distinguish between the indigenous life and the exotics that have contaminated it. What are the odds that we're getting this right? I think that they're not that good. Finally, and I have only time to raise the question and I'm not gonna explore it, although perhaps we can do so in the discussion period. How do we factor in human influence into the biotic community? This is particularly a concern with prairies, since prairies need to be burned periodically, something that has required human intervention for a long time, including burning by Native Americans before European settlers got here. Most prairies also require some sort of weeding, in some way, to eradicate exotic species that inevitably contaminate it. How much do these considerations affect and undermine the identity of prairies as biotic communities? I think it makes their identity more dependent on us. To sum up, because many apparently intrinsic values turn out to be instrumental when we look at them more closely. And also because it's not clear that prairies, today at least, have the sort of wholeness or integrity that makes them even potential objects of value in their own right. I have to conclude that prairies do not have intrinsic value. That doesn't mean we should not preserve and cherish them, but it does mean that we need a different moral foundation and justification for that preservation. Thank you.\r\n\r\n- We've decided because of the time to go right into comments and questions. And what we'll do is I'll sort of umpire. I'll point at you, and then you've got the floor and identify the person with whom you'd like to talk. Mike? We're given the assumption of beauty from some of your earlier discussion, it seems like you've given us a test the way something is intrinsically valuable. And let me see if I got this right, what those tests are. The first one is that something X would not be valuable if it's possible that adding more X would not be valuable. So, for example, in the discussion of beauty, it would not be valuable to make a prairie more beautiful by adding those flowers, and therefore beauty isn't particularly, that can't be what makes this intrinsically valuable. Your second criteria of when something would be intrinsically valuable is the would not be complete or unified. And given the, assuming these are the two tests that you want to propose, I'm wondering whether anything is intrinsically valuable in your opinion.\r\n\r\n- Okay. I think that, let me take the second one first. That test is something that I took from Professor Callicott. That is, he wants to say that one way of showing that something is at least a possible object for value is to show that it's a community. And I think that that sense of community that he's evoking implicitly requires some sort of wholeness and integrity and in fact, I think he would agree that integrity plays an important role in defining that. So I'm just using his test there. Now let's see, the first one, that wasn't my intention. The reason I talked about purple loosestrife and adding other flowers is that I think that when we ask what makes something better or worse, that can give us a clue. It's sort of a tactical move. That can give us a clue as to why we value something. So if, for example, I'm a coin collector and I automatically say, \"Well, the older one is better.\" That might give me a clue as to what it is I value about those coins. When we find out that getting rid of purple loosestrife rather than adding it adds value to the prairie, makes it better, that gives us a clue as to why we value prairies. The real test. I mean, that's just a clue for say, it turns out not to be variety in any sense but authenticity that we care about. That's what getting rid of the purple loosestrife gives us. Now, the question is, is authenticity an intrinsic or an instrumental value? Well, do we value things as authentic because they enable us to do something else, do something further? And there, I think I'm following again Professor Callicott's definition. So what I was trying to do was just apply his tests, but show that things like authenticity turn out to be valued not for their own sake, but because they, as I said, get us closer to our historical roots or illustrate an ecosystem that used to be a very important part of this land and so on. So I would say that in the case of your first test that's not a test that I wanna use, the way you described it.\r\n\r\n- Baird, do you have anything to go with that?\r\n\r\n- No.\r\n\r\n- Next. Michelle.\r\n\r\n- Professor Callicott, like professor Russow, I'm worried about your accounts of intrinsic value. You rejected rationality as a criterion for ascribing intrinsic value to something, but I'm afraid that your account of intrinsic value is gonna be too narrow, too, because it doesn't seem as though it would allow for the intrinsic value of a piece of art or something like that, which we would normally say has intrinsic value as well. On the other hand, I'm afraid that if you give an account of intrinsic value that would include things like that that aren't moving, it's going to be so broad and so hard to give a foundation for, that you're gonna be winding up trying to defend the view that value is inherent to nature which is just what you want to avoid. Do you have any response to that?\r\n\r\n- Yes. I'm gonna take the easy way out in saying that I don't find art to be intrinsically valuable and this despite the fact that my dad is an artist, and I very much respect him and I very much value his painting, for example. We're sitting in an art gallery right now, so I've got to be careful what I say about this. But I think that art is instrumentally valuable, it's a human artifact, it's something that human beings make. And I think that its value is subordinate to the interest that we take in it. Here's a test by the way, or another test for justifying this, off of the very first paper of environmental philosophy which was delivered, published in a very obscure place, it was at one of the World Conferences of Philosophy, held in Bulgaria. And in the insets it has a Bulgarian publication date. It has been printed, however, in a recent anthology, by one of the paper's authors was Richard Sylvan and the paper was called, \"Do We Need a New Environmental Ethic?\" And someone, in that paper, proposes the following test. He called it the last person or last, last group of people, the last society. And the test is as follows, if, from the prevailing point of view where nature is concerned, it would not be wrong for the last person, as Sylvan from Australia puts it, to lay about destroying all other natural things. Now let's apply this to art. Would the last person do something ethically wrong? If there was only one last, suppose that some, that AIDS or something like that becomes uncontrollable, spread through the entire population, becomes an airborne virus. And we have the last person left alive on the planet, who goes into the Louvre and begins destroying the paintings there. I would say that the last person does nothing wrong. He's, you know, there's nothing, there's no ethical judgment here because there are no future human beings who will appreciate this art and art without human appreciators is of no value. However, Sylvan says, and I agree, that the last person would do something very wrong if he or she were to go about destroying all the whales or all the elephants, or all the redwoods and so on. All the other organic things, or to take all the nuclear weapons and set off a nuclear explosion in order to destroy as much life as possible and see if he could take the rest of the living world with him. So I'll accept your criticism, that I am going to be giving up some things that we wouldn't really take as intrinsically valuable, in part in order to save my theory, but in part because it also agrees with my intuitions about this.\r\n\r\n- Michelle, you wanna get in on it? Oh, sorry, Lilly.\r\n\r\n- I don't think we maybe wanna get into it, Baird, but I think that that criterion is inconsistent with the account of value with which you began, about the intrinsic value in what valuers can value for its own sake rather than for something else. I don't think that those two tests, that test, the test you just proposed will fit that definition, because according to the definition that you gave earlier, a painting is intrinsically valuable or intrinsically valued if we value the painting for its own sake, rather than for something--\r\n\r\n- But I don't think we do, that's the point I'm trying to make. But I think that we value it for the aesthetic experience that it provides us, not for its own sake, just as we value, to be fair, grading complicated things with trivial ones, we value ice cream because it gives us pleasure of a certain sort. Similarly, we value art for the same reason, and . That's what .\r\n\r\n- Next question or comment? Yes. What?\r\n\r\n- Can anyone ever understand what they mean by \"for its own sake\"?\r\n\r\n- I tried to provide some examples. I think we have good examples right here. I'm saying that art objects are not valued for their own sake. However, the example, I did try to give a few examples of what humans do value for their own sake, it seems to me that the most clear case, at least for those of us who are parents and perhaps for those of us who have parents, which would include everyone, is the way parents value their children. I mean, children can be for parents, a real nuisance in asset, they're expensive. Lots of times they turn out to be rotten. You know, and how many mothers of social misfits, and downright criminals, nevertheless value intrinsically their children? Their children are useless to them, useless to society, and so on and yet are valued for their own sake. Now, this seems to be to me as clear of an example, and this is my touchstone that I'm trying to suggest. Yes, we know what it is to value something for its own sake, for example the way parents value their children. And then let's see if we can work out from that, that sure footing. And by way of analogy and similarity, are there other things that we can take this as a, as an experience that we have, and also find ourselves valuing other things, you know, in a similar way?\r\n\r\n- Let me just follow up on that, okay? And push this between the two of you a little further. What would be the difference in the policies of the government of the state of Iowa, were you or Lilly, but not both, advising the legislature and the government with regard to policy concerning prairies in the state of Iowa, what would be the difference?\r\n\r\n- Yeah, the difference is this. This is a question that's been pressed by our colleague Brian Norton, who was also an ample essentialist, to say, things of a nature though having this full range of instrumental values, which Lilly so nicely suggested, not just what would you call them, phenomenal objects or something like that, to pedestrian things, but that we instrumentally value nature in all sorts of higher ways, for aesthetic, as an aesthetic resource, as a sacred place. It transforms us, it makes us better and so on. When we bring all of these values, instrumental values to bear upon nature, our colleague Brian Norton suggests that we have what he calls the convergence hypothesis. And the intrinsic value thesis and the instrumental value thesis converge in precisely the same policy. So all of this dispute, and this is Norton's point, though he is a philosopher, I regard him a somewhat anti-philosophical philosopher, he says that all of this talk about intrinsic value is worse than a mere academic debate. It distracts attention from the real issues which are pragmatic in policy. We shouldn't be here talking about how we value prairies, we should be trying to implement the values that we have and especially this notion of intrinsic value is controversial. So let's leave that out. That's the only divisive among environmentalists. And let's just go with conservative, anthropocentric and instrumental view. Now I have, I think that Norton was dead wrong about this. I think that there is a significant and a profound impact, practical impact, that intrinsic value makes in the policy arena. And what does that impact? It shifts the burden of proof from those who want to appropriate and use, excuse me, it shifts the burden of proof from those who want to save prairies to those who want to appropriate and use them for developmental purposes. Because if something has intrinsic value, then it has a prima facie right or case to exist. If on the other hand, it's only instrumentally valuable, then it has to compete head to head with all of the other possible uses, all of the other instrumental uses. And generally, if it's a shopping mall as opposed to a prairie then, and we translate all of our instrumental values, this is what economists do, they make a cottage industry out of this. They, they put a dollar value on it. Okay, you find the prairie beautiful. You find it a a place of solitude and spiritual inspiration. How much is that worth to you? We can, we put a dollar value on art. Let's put a dollar value on our aesthetic experience and then compare that with the economic benefits of a shopping mall, and what's gonna happen? The shopping mall is gonna win in practically each and every case, unless we're talking about something so gorgeous, and so traditionally cherished as the Yosemite Valley or something like that, in which case then, perhaps if we talk about all the tourist dollars and so on that go into it. So if we say that it's intrinsically valuable and if we can make a persuasive case for this that persuades the public, and we've done this, there's a precedent for this, by the way, in the Endangered Species Act, then the burden of proof has shifted to those who want to appropriate and use it. They have to prove that that they're, the instrumental values are so overwhelming that they cancel, or we can set aside the intrinsic value.\r\n\r\n- Lilly, any reply?\r\n\r\n- I think that Baird is right in saying that in terms of deciding which practical policies we would both advocate, that it's not going to, our philosophical differences aren't going to make much difference. I disagree with him about the fact that talking about intrinsic value versus instrumental value should shift the burden of proof. That is, it would be a justification for shifting the burden of proof onto those who want to use, tear up the prairie. Only if we had this picture of instrumental value as somehow better, higher than all instrumental values. I think in fact, both instrumental and intrinsic values are gonna have to go head to head, which, in any kind of conflict, and the problem is gonna be as difficult for one sort of value as for the other. Now, I put that in terms of it shouldn't hurt. I think that when we try to give reasons to support our policies, explain how we think these things, these conflicts ought to be decided. We could go Madison Avenue and it may turn out that intrinsic value is a nice catch slogan, is gonna get people to vote. But I don't think either Baird or I want to say that in a good community, we manipulate the citizens that way, we want to give the best possible reasons. And I think on that basis, we have to go back to, does it make sense to talk in this way?\r\n\r\n- Good. Yes, Margaret?\r\n\r\n- I have a question for Professor Russow. You said and I'm inclined to agree, it's not just to say that we do value things certain ways but you have to say there's a proper object value and you have reasons to back it up. Now you have a suggestion and I can see just how you cash that out for things that have instrumental value, the value of an object for but I'm wondering how you would, what kind of reason you could give for valuing something intrinsically, in the theoretical framework that you use?\r\n\r\n- Okay, just sort of a general sort of disclaimer, I chose to sort of work within what you're calling this objectivist framework, that is looking at the value rather than for an objective value out there in the world, just so that we could have a starting point on which we both agree. Just set that sort of very basic philosophical question aside for the time being. But from a subjectivist point of view, it may turn out, and I think Baird's example of a parent and a child is a good one. It may just be a basic human reaction that we can tell, I think he would want to tell, sort of an evolutionary story about it, perhaps and I'll give him that. And there are probably, I think there are, other sorts of situations in which that immediate sympathy, empathy, resonance, appreciation is just triggered in us. And there's simply you, you hit a base level value. I'm willing to stick with that for the purposes of this discussion.\r\n\r\n- Does that take us, does it take us, from both of your perspectives, in this kind of a direction? Ultimately the answer to the question, how do you identify what is straightforwardly, or in your senses, intrinsically valuable, has more to do with those who do the valuing and less to do with what is valued, when it comes to the matter of explaining exactly what it is that makes anything intrinsically valuable?\r\n\r\n- No, I don't think so. I think that we, to come back to policy and so on, that what we're doing here in part is something for, I'm saying this for the benefit of the non-philosophers in the audience, something called meta-ethics. That is to say, we're trying to identify here this, we're trying to say something about ethics and what its foundations are, and so on. I think that in policy debates, we assume these, these foundations, we just, we don't, we don't talk about them, we know that we have, that we value things, that perhaps we're not clear about this, that's why we do philosophy about it and try to make these things clear and raise them to the surface. But these are sort of the assumed things, the under the surface things. They're very often not very well articulated and so on but nevertheless they're assumed. And so what we do is talk about the various objects that are candidates for things that we intrinsically value. And there are some paradigm cases, parents and their children, for example, children as intrinsically valuable things. And then we have some problematic things. Should we value something like other animals? And then how do we address this issue? We've got animal rights people, what are they trying, how do they try and convince us? Well, they talk about animals. They talk about the capacities of animals. Did you guys see, about, let me see, I think it was in about March last year, a Time Magazine cover with a chimpanzee on it? And it was all about how we undervalued animal mental capacities. So we talk about animals. These are the sorts of capacities that they have. And those happen to be the sorts of capacities that, in my language here, sort of tickle our, our intrinsic value nerve cells, so to speak. They stimulate in us intrinsic value. Now, as an environmentalist, I want to go beyond the rather straightforward and simple case of animals and I wanna talk about species and biotic communities. Do they have the kinds of characteristics that address our intrinsic value dimensions of our nervous systems as it were?\r\n\r\n- Mike, go ahead.\r\n\r\n- I'm very worried about basing intrinsic value on evolution. It might turn out, after all, that E.O. Wilson was right, and our biological natures would make us extraordinarily speciesist, or extraordinarily sexist, or maybe even extraordinarily racist. Now should this biological fact just happen to be the case, it seems to me that no one would want to adopt a view of intrinsic value that made these things, just because you have these, these racist neurons or speciesist neurons, nobody, I think would want to adopt intrinsic value. To me, those things actually are intrinsically shocking.\r\n\r\n- Well, racists and sexists might well want to, but certainly I don't. And certainly.\r\n\r\n- Right. But then the question, but then Margaret's question comes back, right?\r\n\r\n- Yeah, and let me try to answer it. Obviously this is a problem, obviously with a theory like mine, that I have, I have to think long and hard about. I think that what you're assuming is, and Wilson, when he's had an opportunity to think about this correctly, to reflect on what he has, feeling shocked when he knows what said about these things to someone enjoying their work, would also agree, and that is that that such things are not hardwired. That is to say, that our moral, let me put it this way. Our moral sentiments are under-determined. We come into the world conservative, and I do think that we have, there is a sense of us, and an order of community, and that in order for there to be a sense of us, there's got to be an other, a them, that sort of outside our community. And the history of moral consciousness as Darwin reviews it, and I think that Ms. Whithall is building upon it, is that we expand our sense of what it means to belong, our sense of us. We begin to include the people on the other side of the river who used to be stigmatized as subhuman, and now we have come to an inclusive humanism. The next step is animals and the environment and so on. So where is the other? And this is what I call the Copernican concept. The Copernican dimension of the land ethic. I mean, we're now representing our planet from the point of view of the moonshot as a community in a hostile sort of solar system and beyond. That's the other, this is the community. And so we feel that we live on a cozy and small planet. Now all of this is what I call cognitively massaging our evolved sentiments. We're not hard wired for these sorts of, traditional limitations on ethics entirely.\r\n\r\n- Lilly, jump in.\r\n\r\n- Yeah. I think that, what I was gonna say to that and to what you were suggesting would also perhaps answer your question, and it gets back to the point that I made at the very beginning, that if we're gonna be talking about what we should value, we have to be prepared to give reasons. As soon as you give reasons, you have to sort of play by the rules of reasons and one of those rules is consistency. And that's the standard argument against sexism, against racism. Singer tries to generate it, he used, extended it to an argument against speciesism. But it comes back to, once you've been forced to articulate why you value X, whether that value be intrinsic or instrumental, you then have to be prepared to accept the fact that in order to be consistent, you have to value other things that have that same kind of characteristics. So again, I would agree with Baird in this sense, that when we start looking for what sorts of things we value, we have to look to the things we value and why we value them. But I think that that's going to also provide a bulwark against the sort of provincialism that you were concerned about.\r\n\r\n- It's the bewitching hour, 9:30. We'd like to thank Lilly and Baird for being our guests. And we'd also like to thank you very much for coming. Good night.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://iastate.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1150/collection_resources/42975/file/115640#t=0.0,2717.976"}]}]}]}